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Title: Obama on DC Jihadis: "Fiercely loyal Muslims"
Source: Atlas Shrugs
URL Source: http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/ ... is-fiercely-loyal-muslims.html
Published: Dec 11, 2009
Author: staff
Post Date: 2009-12-11 09:48:16 by Joe Snuffy
Keywords: War on Terror, Obama, US Muslim terrorists
Views: 30082
Comments: 91

Obama on DC Jihadis: "Fiercely loyal Muslims"

Crazy, man.

Check out the TOTUS's response today to the devastating news of five DC Muslim students tracked down and arrested in Pakistan. They were plotting jihad. What did Pres Moe say? He speaks about fiercely loyal Muslims ....loyal to whom exactly?

(vid hat tip KGS)

Obama spent a month in Pakistan during his college years ....perhaps he is, uh, sympathetic.

Here is a sampling of different posts in the past three months of fiercely loyal Muslim activity here in the good old USA:

Chicago Muslim Charged In Mumbai Islamic Massacre Planned More Terror Attacks in India

AMERICAN JIHAD: FBI INVESTIGATING 5 MISSING MUSLIM STUDENTS IN DC, POSSIBLE ARREST IN PAKISTAN

“I said he was acting...like a terrorist,” roommate of Jihadi who Murdered Binghamton Professor

Muslims of America Domestic Terror Jihad training camp videos to be released

Chicago Jihadis who Plotted to bomb Danish Cartoon Publisher at Halal Slaughterhouse Tied to Mumbai

Muslim Sentenced to Six-year jail term in Plot to Blow up Sears Tower: "Islamic terrorism is one of the most tremendous problem that this country now confronts ... this defendant took an oath to Al-Qaeda"

Beltway Jihadi Sniper John Muhammad: Death to the Jihadi Tonight

Fort Hood Jihad

Going Muslim on a Photographer outside Michigan Mosque

Son of an Imam Killed in Gun Battle with the FBI in Detroit is Arrested


Michigan Mosque leader killed during Islamic gun battle with fed

Hush Hush: Huge Fed/FBI Raid on Chicago Halal Goat Meat Slaughterhouse


Boston Muslim Terrorist Son of MAS (Muslim American Society) Leader


Another Conviction of Muslims Engaged in Plotting Islamic Attacks Against American Overseas

NY Imam Indicted in NYC Terror Attack Plot

Massive Muslim Attack Averted: "plot to kill two prominent US politicians and carry out a holy war by attacking shoppers in US malls and American troops in Iraq"

Obama First Female Veiled Islamist Appointee, Dalia Mogahed, Promotes Sharia, Says it's "Misunderstood

"New York Muslim indicted for plotting to kill U.S. troopswww.dallasnews.com/shared...ombarrest.1b177db8b.html" target="_blank">

www.dallasnews.com/shared...ombarrest.1b177db8b.html" target="_blank">FBI arrests Jordanian for downtown Dallas bomb plot...

NYC: Muslims Protest "RACIAL PROFILING" in wake of arrests in major jihad terror plot


www.reuters.com/article/m...ws/idUSN2447383520090924" target="_blank">Illinois man charged in plot to bomb federal offices...

www.reuters.com/article/d...ws/idUSTRE58N6YT20090924" target="_blank">Terror suspects accused of targeting Marine base in Quantico...

cbs3.com/local/SEPTA.Broad.Street.2.1206878.html" target="_blank">Men vanish after taking photos of Philly subway system...

Click for Full Text!

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#1. To: Joe Snuffy (#0)

They were plotting jihad.

It's amazing that most Americans do NOT know what the term Jihad means. If they did, they would stop using it as a terrorist act.

Jihad describes the ethics and morals of the Muslims. Jihad is the internal fight between right and wrong, moral and immoral, selfishness and selflessness, etc. The inner peach and equilibrium is then reflected outward in an attempt to create peace and harmony in society. Jihad is not about waging wars on others. Jihad does promote self-defense.

For all the sick twisted freaks committing acts of violence in the name of Islam, the true Muslims know Allah will send them to hell as they are in direct violation of Allah's commandments given to the people through the prophet Mohammad, recorded in the Qur'an.

Every group of people has extremists that carry out atrocities against other people or even their own people. Some do it in the name of one religion or another and some do it in the name of a race or a country. Some are simply psycho freaks.

Happy Birthday Jesus! Merry Christmas everyone!

mel  posted on  2009-12-11   11:40:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: mel (#1)

Bull shiite

Islam does not mean peace it means submission to Alla aka Islam by whatever means necessary...

It is a religion of death and Baal worship...demonically inspired

Joe Snuffy  posted on  2009-12-11   11:58:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: Joe Snuffy (#2)

That is of course what people expect you to say. It's been engraved in your brain and nothing will ever enlighten you. We must continue to believe the stereotypes and lables that all Muslims are evil and wicked because to actually learn something and tell the truth would be too difficult to do. If you ever actually met a real Muslim you would automatically see the person as evil and the person would never be able to convince you otherwise even if it was the nicest, most decent person you ever met. Keep telling the blacks in the ghetto that they're worthless and will never be anything more than criminal drug dealers/addicts and that is exactly what they will become.

Happy Birthday Jesus! Merry Christmas everyone!

mel  posted on  2009-12-11   12:07:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: All (#3)

Most illegal immigrants are Catholics which means the Catholics have staged the greatest invasion of the US of all times. The Catholics are illegal loving, criminal scum and they must be stopped along with the Islamics by any means necessary. Think about it, Catholic priests are known to be pedophiles. Catholic Churches offer illegals sancturary. They are evil.

/SARCASM

Happy Birthday Jesus! Merry Christmas everyone!

mel  posted on  2009-12-11   12:16:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: All (#4)

I'm going to go blow up a building and say I did it in the name of Islam. Everyone will believe me. No one would ever question my true motives as it is already assumed all over the US that anytime anything like that happens some Muslim had to be involved because a person of any other religion would never do such a thing.

/SARCASM

Happy Birthday Jesus! Merry Christmas everyone!

mel  posted on  2009-12-11   12:22:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: Joe Snuffy (#2)

Islam does not mean peace it means submission to Alla aka Islam by whatever means necessary...

It is a religion of death and Baal worship...demonically inspired

For one to thoroughly comprehend the phenomenon of modern Islamic terrorism and to combat that phenomenon - it is necessary to study why and how its rise is a political reaction to imperialism.

To fight one’s enemy, one must know one’s enemy and simply arriving at a decisive conclusion that “all” Muslims are “bad” Muslims and “all” Muslims because they are "bab" practice terrorism - isn’t much of an combative ammunition cache to have assess to.

To begin the fight against modern Islamic terrorism, one must dispel the notion that terrorism is factually based in culture, rather than based in politics.

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-11   13:03:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Joe Snuffy (#0)

Moderate Mammal  posted on  2009-12-11   17:37:15 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: Moderate Mammal (#7)

Muslim Mammal, sign holder extraordinaire,....which one are you?

What's the difference between Racism_Boot's mouth and anal pore? There isn't any, they both spew gas and feces.

Ibluafartsky  posted on  2009-12-11   18:06:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: mel (#1)

Every group of people has extremists that carry out atrocities against other people or even their own people. Some do it in the name of one religion or another and some do it in the name of a race or a country. Some are simply psycho freaks.

Reeeeallly, Teach? You mean Muslims and Christians are the same after all?

Wow, you ARE an Airhead.

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-11   21:10:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: Joe Snuffy, mel (#2)

Islam does not mean peace it means submission to Alla aka Islam by whatever means necessary...

It is a religion of death and Baal worship...demonically inspired

How dare you question our new PHD in Religious Propaganda?

Mel studied soooo hard and for sooo long.

Islam is a "Religion of Peace." The lack of terrorism by Muslims is universally well-known; Their tolerance, charity, generosity, mental stability, and tradition of welcoming diversity in ALL Muslim nations is widely accepted, Joe.

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-11   21:18:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: Joe Snuffy (#0)

He [The Kenyan Muslim President] speaks about fiercely loyal Muslims ....loyal to whom exactly?

To Satan? To the insane voices in their heads? To those who are "loyal" to their mantra of "DEATH TO THE INFIDEL!!!"

America-Hating Hussein strokes Islam whenever possible.

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-11   21:22:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Liberator, Mel (#9) (Edited)

You mean Muslims and Christians are the same after all?

Is that what she meant?

Hmm ... Let me go back and read it again.

Okay, I did.

I don’t see where she meant to say that Islamic Allah and Christian God are the same. We all should know that they in fact are not. They are even extremely difficult to compare.

As it is also even very difficult to compare Christianity within Christian religion, because there is such a wide range of beliefs and practices among various wings of Christianity: Roman Catholicism, Eastern Orthodox churches,

I think she was talking about there being extremist in all religions. If we stop and think about it, I am sure we can find some, maybe many, examples.

Let’s see, I am thinking for instance of the so-called “Army of God” in the U.S. which condones the killing of medical personnel who are involved in abortions.

Yes, It is unfortunate, but there are extremists in every group.

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-11   21:40:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: Tater, mel (#12)

Me: You mean Muslims and Christians are the same after all?

Is that what she meant?

Hmm ... Let me go back and read it again.

Okay, I did.

I don’t see where she meant to say that Islamic Allah and Christian God are the same.

Mel:

"Every group of people has extremists that carry out atrocities against other people or even their own people. Some do it in the name of one religion or another and some do it in the name of a race or a country. Some are simply psycho freaks."

And NO "group of people" are anywhere NEAR extremist or deliver more terrorism against other people than...ISLAM.

She is a Muslim Apologist.

Yes, It is unfortunate, but there are extremists in every group.

Yes, but it's unfortunate that in 99% of the cases, the "extremists" wreaking havoc upon civilized man happen to be MUSLIM. Precisely BECAUSE promoting violence and committing murder are strong tenets of their Cult.

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-11   21:51:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: Tater (#12)

Let’s see, I am thinking for instance of the so-called “Army of God” in the U.S. which condones the killing of medical personnel who are involved in abortions.

Bullshit.........And just how many Medical professionals have been murdered in the name of stopping abortions. Your logic only works if they were murdering people not even connected to the abortion industry in the name of converting everyone to their beliefs and besides that many non religious types believe that killing the unborn is the murder of a human being and should stopped.

Gater  posted on  2009-12-11   22:00:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: Liberator (#13)

...it's unfortunate that in 99% of the cases, the "extremists" wreaking havoc upon civilized man happen to be MUSLIM...

Approximately what percentage?

99% – Where did you get that statistic?

The number is obviously high, but that high?

Did you just make up that number?

I will say that their practice of ungodly politics is usually thinly veiled under an obvious and unfortunate façade of counterfeit spiritualism, while the inconsistency of their action and depravity of spirit contradict their endless claims of godliness.

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-11   22:10:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: Gater (#14)

I believe we are speaking about "definition" and not "degree" at this time.

The Army of God (AOG) is defined as an extremist anti-abortion organization that sanctions the use of force to combat abortion in the United States.

That is all I was saying.

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-11   22:16:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Tater (#12)

Exactly.

Happy Birthday Jesus! Merry Christmas everyone!

mel  posted on  2009-12-11   23:25:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: Gater (#14)

Your logic only works if they were murdering people not even connected to the abortion industry in the name of converting everyone to their beliefs

Have you ever heard of the Holy Wars?

There are many accounts of such things happening in World history that didn't include Muslims.

Atrocities occur all the time but no one pays attention to them unless the perpetrator claims to be Muslim these days.

Just as not all Catholic Priests are pedophiles and not all Mormen men are polygamists, not all Muslims are radical killers. Not all early Americans were slave holders. Not all white people supported the oppression of black people. Not all Hispanics are illegal and not all illegals are from Mexico. Not everyone with a Hispanic last name is Hispanic, nor do all of them speak Spanish. Not all Asians are smart either.

Happy Birthday Jesus! Merry Christmas everyone!

mel  posted on  2009-12-11   23:45:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: All (#18)

"Those who believe (in the Quran), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians...and (all) who believe in God and the last day and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve." The Qur'an, 2:62

According to the Qur'an, Muslims are to accept other religions and live in peace among them. Just as there are those who call themselves Christians who do not follow God's commands, there are those who call themselves Muslims who do not follow Allah's commands.

Since somebody felt like bringing up Christians....

Listed are only events that solely occurred on command or participation of church authorities or were committed in the name of Christianity. (List incomplete)

Ancient Pagans

•As soon as Christianity became legal in the Roman Empire by imperial edict (315), more and more pagan temples were destroyed by Christian mob. Pagan priests were killed.

•Between 315 and 6th century thousands of pagan believers were slain.

•Examples of destroyed Temples: the Sanctuary of Aesculap in Aegaea, the Temple of Aphrodite in Golgatha, Aphaka in Lebanon, the Heliopolis.

•Christian priests such as Mark of Arethusa or Cyrill of Heliopolis were famous as "temple destroyer." [DA468]

•Pagan services became punishable by death in 356. [DA468]

•Christian Emperor Theodosius (408-450) even had children executed, because they had been playing with remains of pagan statues. [DA469] According to Christian chroniclers he "followed meticulously all Christian teachings..."

•In 6th century pagans were declared void of all rights.

•In the early fourth century the philosopher Sopatros was executed on demand of Christian authorities. [DA466]

•The world famous female philosopher Hypatia of Alexandria was torn to pieces with glass fragments by a hysterical Christian mob led by a Christian minister named Peter, in a church, in 415. [DO19-25]

Mission

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

•Emperor Karl (Charlemagne) in 782 had 4500 Saxons, unwilling to convert to Christianity, beheaded. [DO30]

•Peasants of Steding (Germany) unwilling to pay suffocating church taxes: between 5,000 and 11,000 men, women and children slain 5/27/1234 near Altenesch/Germany. [WW223]

•15th century Poland: 1019 churches and 17987 villages plundered by Knights of the Order. Number of victims unknown. [DO30]

•16th and 17th century Ireland. English troops "pacified and civilized" Ireland, where only Gaelic "wild Irish", "unreasonable beasts lived without any knowledge of God or good manners, in common of their goods, cattle, women, children and every other thing." One of the more successful soldiers, a certain Humphrey Gilbert, half-brother of Sir Walter Raleigh, ordered that "the heddes of all those (of what sort soever thei were) which were killed in the daie, should be cutte off from their bodies... and should bee laied on the ground by eche side of the waie", which effort to civilize the Irish indeed caused "greate terrour to the people when thei sawe the heddes of their dedde fathers, brothers, children, kinsfolke, and freinds on the grounde". Tens of thousands of Gaelic Irish fell victim to the carnage. [SH99, 225]

Crusades (1095-1291)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

•First Crusade: 1095 on command of pope Urban II. [WW11-41]

•Semlin/Hungary 6/24/96 thousands slain. Wieselburg/Hungary 6/12/96 thousands. [WW23]

•9/9/96-9/26/96 Nikaia, Xerigordon (then Turkish), thousands respectively. [WW25-27]

•Until January 1098 a total of 40 capital cities and 200 castles conquered (number of slain unknown) [WW30]

•After 6/3/98 Antiochia (then Turkish) conquered, between 10,000 and 60,000 slain. 6/28/98 100,000 Turks (incl. women and children) killed. [WW32-35] Here the Christians "did no other harm to the women found in [the enemy's] tents - save that they ran their lances through their bellies," according to Christian chronicler Fulcher of Chartres. [EC60]

•Marra (Maraat an-numan) 12/11/98 thousands killed. Because of the subsequent famine "the already stinking corpses of the enemies were eaten by the Christians" said chronicler Albert Aquensis. [WW36]

Jerusalem conquered 7/15/1099 more than 60,000 victims (Jewish, Muslim, men, women, children). [WW37-40] In the words of one witness: "there [in front of Solomon's temple] was such a carnage that our people were wading ankle-deep in the blood of our foes", and after that "happily and crying for joy our people marched to our Saviour's tomb, to honour it and to pay off our debt of gratitude."

•The Archbishop of Tyre, eye-witness, wrote: "It was impossible to look upon the vast numbers of the slain without horror; everywhere lay fragments of human bodies, and the very ground was covered with the blood of the slain. It was not alone the spectacle of headless bodies and mutilated limbs strewn in all directions that roused the horror of all who looked upon them. Still more dreadful was it to gaze upon the victors themselves, dripping with blood from head to foot, an ominous sight which brought terror to all who met them. It is reported that within the Temple enclosure alone about ten thousand infidels perished." [TG79]

•Christian chronicler Eckehard of Aura noted that "even the following summer in all of Palestine the air was polluted by the stench of decomposition". [WW41]

•Battle of Askalon, 8/12/1099. Thousands of heathens slaughtered "in the name of Our Lord Jesus Christ". [WW45]

•Fourth crusade: 4/12/1204 Constantinople sacked, number of victims unknown, numerous thousands, many of them Christian. [WW141-148]

•Crusades (1095-1291)

Ê2;Estimated totals:

Ã2;Wertham: 1,000,000

Ã2;Charles Mackay, Memoirs of Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds (1841): 2,000,000 Europeans killed. [http://www.bootlegbooks.com/NonFiction/Mackay/PopDelusions/chap09.html]

Ã2;Aletheia, The Rationalist's Manual: 5,000,000

Ê2;Individual Events:

Ã2;Davies: Crusaders killed up to 8,000 Jews in Rhineland

Ã2;Paul Johnson A History of the Jews (1987): 1,000 Jewish women in Rhineland comm. suicide to avoid the mob, 1096.

Ã2;Gibbon, Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, v.5, 6

Ã2;1st Crusade: 300,000 Eur. k at Battle of Nice [Nicea].

Ã2;Crusaders vs. Solimon of Roum: 4,000 Christians, 3,000 Moslems

Ã2;1098, Fall of Antioch: 100,000 Moslems massacred.

Ã2;50,000 Pilgrims died of disease.

Ã2;1099, Fall of Jerusalem: 70,000 Moslems massacred.

Ã2;Siege of Tiberias: 30,000 Christians k.

Ã2;Siege of Tyre: 1,000 Turks

Ã2;Richard the Lionhearted executes 3,000 Moslem POWs.

Ã2;1291: 100,000 Christians k after fall of Acre.

Ã2;Fall of Christian Antioch: 17,000 massacred.

Ã2;[TOTAL: 677,000 listed in these episodes here.]

Ã2;Catholic Encyclopedia (1910) [http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/]

Ã2;Jaffa: 20,000 Christians massacred, 1197

Ã2;Sorokin estimates that French, English & Imperial German Crusaders lost a total of 3,600 in battle.

Ã2;1st C (1096-99): 400

Ã2;2nd C (1147-49): 750

Ã2;3rd C (1189-91): 930

Ã2;4th C (1202-04): 120

Ã2;5th C (1228-29): 600

Ã2;7th C (1248-54): 700

Ã2;James Trager, The People's Chronology (1992)

Ã2;1099: Crusaders slaughter 40,000 inhabs of Jerusalem. Dis/starv reduced Crusaders from 300,000 to 60,000.

Ã2;1147: 2nd Crusades begins with 500,000. "Most" lost to starv./disease/battle.

Ã2;1190: 500 Jews massacred in York.

Ã2;1192: 3rd Crusade reduced from 100,000 to 5,000 through famine, plagues and desertions in campaign vs Antioch.

Ã2;1212: Children's Crusade loses some 50,000.

Ã2;[TOTAL: Just in these incidents, it appears the Europeans lost around 650,000.]

Ê2;TOTAL: When I take all the individual death tolls listed here, weed out the duplicates, fill in the blanks, apply Occam ("Pluralitas non est ponenda sine necessitate"), etc. I get a very rough total of 1½ M deaths in the Crusades.

Jerusalem conquered 7/15/1099 more than 60,000 victims (Jewish, Muslim, men, women, children). [WW37-40] In the words of one witness: "there [in front of Solomon's temple] was such a carnage that our people were wading ankle-deep in the blood of our foes", and after that "happily and crying for joy our people marched to our Saviour's tomb, to honour it and to pay off our debt of gratitude."

•The Archbishop of Tyre, eye-witness, wrote: "It was impossible to look upon the vast numbers of the slain without horror; everywhere lay fragments of human bodies, and the very ground was covered with the blood of the slain. It was not alone the spectacle of headless bodies and mutilated limbs strewn in all directions that roused the horror of all who looked upon them. Still more dreadful was it to gaze upon the victors themselves, dripping with blood from head to foot, an ominous sight which brought terror to all who met them. It is reported that within the Temple enclosure alone about ten thousand infidels perished." [TG79]

•Christian chronicler Eckehard of Aura noted that "even the following summer in all of Palestine the air was polluted by the stench of decomposition". [WW41]

•Battle of Askalon, 8/12/1099. Thousands of heathens slaughtered "in the name of Our Lord Jesus Christ". [WW45]

•Fourth crusade: 4/12/1204 Constantinople sacked, number of victims unknown, numerous thousands, many of them Christian. [WW141-148]

•Crusades (1095-1291)

Ê2;Estimated totals:

Ã2;Wertham: 1,000,000

Ã2;Charles Mackay, Memoirs of Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds (1841): 2,000,000 Europeans killed. [http://www.bootlegbooks.com/NonFiction/Mackay/PopDelusions/chap09.html]

Ã2;Aletheia, The Rationalist's Manual: 5,000,000

Ê2;Individual Events:

Ã2;Davies: Crusaders killed up to 8,000 Jews in Rhineland

Ã2;Paul Johnson A History of the Jews (1987): 1,000 Jewish women in Rhineland comm. suicide to avoid the mob, 1096.

Ã2;Gibbon, Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, v.5, 6

Ã2;1st Crusade: 300,000 Eur. k at Battle of Nice [Nicea].

Ã2;Crusaders vs. Solimon of Roum: 4,000 Christians, 3,000 Moslems

Ã2;1098, Fall of Antioch: 100,000 Moslems massacred.

Ã2;50,000 Pilgrims died of disease.

Ã2;1099, Fall of Jerusalem: 70,000 Moslems massacred.

Ã2;Siege of Tiberias: 30,000 Christians k.

Ã2;Siege of Tyre: 1,000 Turks

Ã2;Richard the Lionhearted executes 3,000 Moslem POWs.

Ã2;1291: 100,000 Christians k after fall of Acre.

Ã2;Fall of Christian Antioch: 17,000 massacred.

Ã2;[TOTAL: 677,000 listed in these episodes here.]

Ã2;Catholic Encyclopedia (1910) [http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/]

Ã2;Jaffa: 20,000 Christians massacred, 1197

Ã2;Sorokin estimates that French, English & Imperial German Crusaders lost a total of 3,600 in battle.

Ã2;1st C (1096-99): 400

Ã2;2nd C (1147-49): 750

Ã2;3rd C (1189-91): 930

Ã2;4th C (1202-04): 120

Ã2;5th C (1228-29): 600

Ã2;7th C (1248-54): 700

Ã2;James Trager, The People's Chronology (1992)

Ã2;1099: Crusaders slaughter 40,000 inhabs of Jerusalem. Dis/starv reduced Crusaders from 300,000 to 60,000.

Ã2;1147: 2nd Crusades begins with 500,000. "Most" lost to starv./disease/battle.

Ã2;1190: 500 Jews massacred in York.

Ã2;1192: 3rd Crusade reduced from 100,000 to 5,000 through famine, plagues and desertions in campaign vs Antioch.

Ã2;1212: Children's Crusade loses some 50,000.

Ã2;[TOTAL: Just in these incidents, it appears the Europeans lost around 650,000.]

Ê2;TOTAL: When I take all the individual death tolls listed here, weed out the duplicates, fill in the blanks, apply Occam ("Pluralitas non est ponenda sine necessitate"), etc. I get a very rough total of 1½ M deaths in the Crusades.

Religious Wars

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

•15th century: Crusades against Hussites, thousands slain. [DO30]

•1538 pope Paul III declared Crusade against apostate England and all English as slaves of Church (fortunately had not power to go into action). [DO31]

•1568 Spanish Inquisition Tribunal ordered extermination of 3 million rebels in (then Spanish) Netherlands. [DO31] Between 5000 and 6000 Protestants were drowned by Spanish Catholic Troops, "a disaster the burghers of Emden first realized when several thousand broad- brimmed Dutch hats floated by." [SH216]

•1572 In France about 20,000 Huguenots were killed on command of pope Pius V. Until 17th century 200,000 flee. [DO31]

•17th century: Catholics slay Gaspard de Coligny, a Protestant leader. After murdering him, the Catholic mob mutilated his body, "cutting off his head, his hands, and his genitals... and then dumped him into the river [...but] then, deciding that it was not worthy of being food for the fish, they hauled it out again [... and] dragged what was left ... to the gallows of Montfaulcon, 'to be meat and carrion for maggots and crows'." [SH191]

•17th century: Catholics sack the city of Magdeburg/Germany: roughly 30,000 Protestants were slain. "In a single church fifty women were found beheaded," reported poet Friedrich Schiller, "and infants still sucking the breasts of their lifeless mothers." [SH191]

•17th century 30 years' war (Catholic vs. Protestant): at least 40% of population decimated, mostly in Germany. [DO31-32]

Jews

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

•Already in the 4th and 5th centuries synagogues were burned by Christians.Number of Jews slain unknown.

•In the middle of the fourth century the first synagogue was destroyed on command of bishop Innocentius of Dertona in Northern Italy. The first synagogue known to have been burned down was near the river Euphrat, on command of the bishop of Kallinikon in the year 388. [DA450]

• 694 17. Council of Toledo: Jews were enslaved, their property confiscated, and their children forcibly baptized. [DA454]

•1010 The Bishop of Limoges (France) had the cities' Jews, who would not convert to Christianity, expelled or killed. [DA453]

•1096 First Crusade: Thousands of Jews slaughtered, maybe 12.000 total. Places: Worms 5/18/1096, Mainz 5/27/1096 (1100 persons), Cologne, Neuss, Altenahr, Wevelinghoven, Xanten, Moers, Dortmund, Kerpen, Trier, Metz, Regensburg, Prag and others (All locations Germany except Metz/France, Prag/Czech) [EJ]

•1147 Second Crusade: Several hundred Jews were slain in Ham, Sully, Carentan, and Rameru (all locations in France). [WW57]

•1189/90 Third Crusade: English Jewish communities sacked. [DO40]

•1235, Fulda/Germany: 34 Jewish men and women slain. [DO41]

•1257, 1267: Jewish communities of London, Canterbury, Northampton, Lincoln, Cambridge, and others exterminated. [DO41]

•1290 Bohemia (Poland) allegedly 10,000 Jews killed. [DO41]

•1337 Starting in Deggendorf/Germany a Jew-killing craze reaches 51 towns in Bavaria, Austria, Poland. [DO41]

•1348 All Jews of Basel/Switzerland and Strasbourg/France (two thousand) burned. [DO41]

•1349 In more than 350 towns in Germany all Jews murdered, mostly burned alive (in this one year more Jews were killed than Christians in 200 years of ancient Roman persecution of Christians). [DO42]

•1389 In Prag 3,000 Jews were slaughtered. [DO42]

•1391 Seville's Jews killed (Archbishop Martinez leading). 4,000 were slain, 25,000 sold as slaves. [DA454] Their identification was made easy by the brightly colored "badges of shame" that all Jews above the age of ten had been forced to wear.

•1492 In the year Columbus set sail to conquer a New World, more than 150,000 Jews were expelled from Spain, many died on their way: 6/30/1492. [MM470-476]

•1648 Chmielnitzki massacres: In Poland about 200,000 Jews were slain. [DO43]

And that's not even half of it. No - Christians are not bad. People are bad. I apologize for no evil person.

Happy Birthday Jesus! Merry Christmas everyone!

mel  posted on  2009-12-12   0:06:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: mel, liberator (#19) (Edited)

Mel: And that's not even half of it. No - Christians are not bad. People are bad. I apologize for no evil person.
Tater: Yes, It is unfortunate, but there are extremists in every group.
Liberator: Yes ... in 99% of the cases, the "extremists" wreaking havoc ... happen to be MUSLIM.

Terrorism can be defined as simply an extreme form of political expression. Given that terrorist attacks occur most often in countries which have despotic regimes, or in which no other form of political protest is available, these people use the only means they can of getting their point across. To some, terrorism is even an acceptable form of political expression when there is no other option available. There are many instances where people arbitrarily label those terrorists who support our value systems to be heroes, while those who oppose our value systems are just dogs murdering innocent people. The complete hypocrisy of this view means that there can be no choice of condemnation when we realize that terrorism is an expression of beliefs, whether we like it or not, and that numerous countries, considered "good" by our current value paradigm have been founded through terrorist actions.

A partial list of designated terrorist organizations is presented below – Point out one Muslim group among them:

Communist Party of India (Maoist); Communist Party of the Philippines/New People's Army; Continuity Irish Republican Army; Cumann na mBan; All Tripura Tiger Force; Babbar Khalsa; Babbar Khalsa International; Baluchistan Liberation Army; Communist Party of the Philippines/New People's Army; Continuity Irish Republican Army; Khmer Rouge/The Party of Democratic Kampuchea; Manuel Rodriguez Patriotic Front (FPMR); National Liberation Army (ELN)— Colombia; Zviadists; Revolutionary Nuclei (RN) a.k.a. Revolutionary Cells; Revolutionary Organization 17 November (17 November); Revolutionary People's Struggle (ELA); Morzanist Patriotic Front (FPM); Kach and Kahane Chai; Aum Supreme Truth (Aum) a.k.a. Aum Shinrikyo, Aleph; Chukaku-Ha (Nucleus or Middle Core Faction); Japanese Red Army (JRA) a.k.a. Anti-Imperialist International Brigade (AIIB); Continuity Irish Republican Army (CIRA) a.k.a. Continuity Army Council; h Republican Army (IRA) a.k.a. Provisional Irish Republican Army (PIRA), the Provos; Loyalist Volunteer Force (LVF); Real IRA (RIRA) a.k.a. True IRA; Red Hand Defenders (RHD); Sendero Luminoso (Shining Path); Tupac Amaru Revolutionary Movement (MRTA); Abu Sayyaf Group (ASG); Alex Boncayao Brigade (ABB); New People's Army (NPA); Army for the Liberation of Rwanda (ALIR), a.k.a. Interahamwe, Former Armed Forces (ex-FAR); Revolutionary United Front (RUF); Qibla and People Against Gangsterism and Drugs (PAGAD); Basque Fatherland and Liberty (ETA), a.k.a. Euzkadi Ta Askatasuna; First of October Antifascist Resistance Group (GRAPO), Grupo de Resistencia Anti-Fascista Premero de Octubre; Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam (LTTE) Other known front organizations: World Tamil Association (WTA), World Tamil Movement (WTM), the Federation of Associations of Canadian Tamils (FACT), the Ellalan Force, the Sangilian Force; Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK); Revolutionary People's Liberation Party/Front (DHKP/C) a.k.a. Devrimci Sol (Revolutionary Left), Dev Sol ... the list goes on … on … and on ... AND ON …

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-12   5:24:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: Tater (#20)

Terrorism can be defined as simply an extreme form of political expression.

Weekly Jihad Report

Nov 28 - Dec 04 Jihad Attacks: 24

Dead Bodies: 144

Critically Injured: 295

What's the difference between Racism_Boot's mouth and anal pore? There isn't any, they both spew gas and feces.

Ibluafartsky  posted on  2009-12-12   5:33:21 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: Ibluafartsky (#21) (Edited)

Terrorism can be defined as simply an extreme form of political expression.

Weekly Jihad Report

Nov 28 - Dec 04 Jihad Attacks: 24

Dead Bodies: 144

Critically Injured: 295

Terrorism is defined by political scientists as the use of politically- motivated violence against civilians.

Terrorism is not supposed to mean "violence against the state" and certainly not "violence against soldiers." It technically also doesn't mean violence directed against military targets where civilians are also hurt/killed.

Using "terrorism" as a specific term is becoming less and less meaningful - however, there doesn't seem to be a good replacement term.

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-12   6:01:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: Tater (#22)

Using "terrorism" as a specific term is becoming less and less meaningful

It has become "indiscriminate slaughter of men, women and children" because of religious fanaticism.

What's the difference between Racism_Boot's mouth and anal pore? There isn't any, they both spew gas and feces.

Ibluafartsky  posted on  2009-12-12   7:08:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: Ibluafartsky (#23) (Edited)

It has become "indiscriminate slaughter of men, women and children" because of religious fanaticism.

Are you clubbing Terrorism with Religion?

I am simply making an attempt to throw open my concerns about what the world is leading to. Some mass scale violence these days can of course be linked to some religion or ethnic group. But terrorism is not singularily a product of religious fanaticism.

The term "terrorism" means premeditated, politically motivated violence perpetrated against noncombatant targets by sub-national groups or clandestine agents usually intended to influence an audience.

All terrorist acts are motivated by two things.

First, terrorist acts are motivated by social and political injustice. This is to say that people choose terrorism when they perceive or realize a social, political or historical wrong and they are trying to right the wrong.

Secondly, the belief that violence or its threat will be effective, and usher in change is also a motivating factor behind terrorist acts. Another way of saying this is to say that the belief that violent means justify the ends.

History has shown that many terrorists sincerely chose violence after long deliberation, because they felt they had no choice.

Terrorism can only be countered through constructive efforts on the part of all the political machinery and religious body in the World.

Am I making any sense? This is really basic stuff.

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-12   7:40:29 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: Gater, Tater (#14)

Tater-Tot: "Let’s see, I am thinking for instance of the so-called “Army of God” in the U.S. which condones the killing of medical personnel who are involved in abortions."

Bullshit.........And just how many Medical professionals have been murdered in the name of stopping abortions.

Great response to Tater-Tot's 100% pure bullsh*t.

Come on Tater - where's the citation of your dopey assertion??

Aaahh, could it be NO WHERE?

FAIL.

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-12   12:41:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: Tater (#15)

99% – Where did you get that statistic?

The number is obviously high, but that high?

The statistic is artificial LOW if anything. It's probably closer to 99.997%

Did you just make up that number?

No, it's according to any Muslim Terrorist Mosque scorecard. They get pissed when the stats falls below 99%.

I will say that their practice of ungodly politics is usually thinly veiled under an obvious and unfortunate façade of counterfeit spiritualism, while the inconsistency of their action and depravity of spirit contradict their endless claims of godliness.

Thank you, Professor. I agree with your assessment that Islam is indeed a Cult of Satanic Loons.

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-12   12:48:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: Tater (#20)

More people have died at the hands of the non-religious than all religions combined.

That is a great list you have found. It is easy to say the atrocities of today are all carried out by Muslims. That's whatthe Government and media have trained people to believe. It's funny that they always talk about not trusting the Government or the media but they seem to believe many things we are told by them. This world is going to hell, as with most of the people in it.

Happy Birthday Jesus! Merry Christmas everyone!

mel  posted on  2009-12-12   13:13:22 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: mel_living (#19)

According to the Qur'an, Muslims are to accept other religions and live in peace among them. Just as there are those who call themselves Christians who do not follow God's commands, there are those who call themselves Muslims who do not follow Allah's commands.

You know - combining Grampa's cough syrup with desert shrooms MIGHT be an excuse for your advocacy as a Muslim Apologist, but I know better; You're even more a dopey airhead than ever imagined.

Those much-ballyhooed "religion" classes didn't help you much.

The doctrine of Jesus Christ does NOT condone murder, violence, and conversion by the sword IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST...Never did; Never will.

Now on the otherhand, what's done "In The Name of Allah" is quite the different story.

What DID you "learn" at those classes, Genius? (hint: get a refund)

That you've managed to cut & paste an historical "Christian atrocities" time-chart is supposed to be impressive as a counter-point for Islam's murderous Cult? Hilarious and pathetic as the same time.

Let's see - you've rolled back the Time Machine back to....350 years ago? Then back to 300 A.D.? What a dumbass. Tribes and humans have been murdering each other before that since....FOREVER.

But comparing the last "violent Christian" events of 350 YEARS AGO to contemporary Islam ?? HA!! And you'd citing no one BUT Christians?? Fraud.

Why don't you cut and paste recent history of Islam, you pathetic Muslim Apologist? AND the verses of Islam condoning and demanding murder, harm AND submission to those who do not yield to Islam. IN THE LAST 50 YEARS, Bimbo.

Geez - my bathroom doorknob has more intellect than you. And honesty. And integrity.

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-12   13:21:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: Tater Tot, Gater (#20)

Whether we like it or not, and that numerous countries, considered "good" by our current value paradigm have been founded through terrorist actions.

Thank you, Abdul for the civics lesson.

A partial list of designated terrorist organizations is presented below – Point out one Muslim group among them...

Yeah - you're right - what are we thinkin'?? ISLAM is actually a "Religion of Peace."

Oh...Which of the above groups do you and mel belong to or have you both converted to the 'Religion of Peace'?

P.S. - Didn't you claim “Army of God” was a terrorist group as well in an earlier post? You know - the one in which you describes it as one "in the U.S. which condones the killing of medical personnel who are involved in abortions"?

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-12   13:30:26 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: mel, all (#27)

It is easy to say the atrocities of today are all carried out by Muslims.

No, it's IMPOSSIBLE to say otherwise. UNLESS one is hitting Grampa's cough syrup, dopey, or brainwashed. At the same time.

That's whatthe Government and media have trained people to believe.

Huh? We've ALL been brainwashed by gubmint?? And MSNBC? You mean Allah IS "good"??

MUSLIM ZOMBIE APOLOGIST ALERT!!

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-12   13:35:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: Liberator (#25)

... where's the citation ...

Why waste my time, you will only attack the messenger and not debate the message – After all, that is your modus operandi

However, since it appears that you want to play Jeopardy - Okay, I’ll take the Bible for One Thousand, Alex ...

The Bible for One Thousand: Can you find at least 10 verses from the bible that pertain to killing non believers, even killing your own family member if they don’t believe in Jesus Christ.

Liberator, are there at least 10 verses (and probably more) in the bible that pertain to killing non believers, even killing your own family member if they don’t believe in Jesus? Your Turn . . .

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-12   14:07:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: Liberator (#26)

99% – Where did you get that statistic? The number is obviously high, but that high?

The statistic is artificial LOW if anything. It's probably closer to 99.997%

Did you just make up that number?

No, it's according to any Muslim Terrorist Mosque scorecard. They get pissed when the stats falls below 99%.

You just proved how little people like you want to hear other people's opinions, but rather just want to hand out blanket dismissals.

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-12   14:10:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: Tater (#32)

You just proved how little people like you want to hear other people's opinions, but rather just want to hand out blanket dismissals.

Any cursory perusal of this thread is evidence of your disingenuous and intellectual dishonesty.

Your dismissal of common sense is also duly noted.

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-12   14:19:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: mel (#27)

... It is easy (for some folks) to say the atrocities of today are all carried out by Muslims ...

... and will forever deny that actually not all terrorists are Muslim.

If you look through history many others have committed terror attacks. Oklahoma City, just to name one. And one cannot and should not forget the IRA they were responsible for quite a few bombings one of the worst was Omagh that killed many out shopping.

So, yes, your statement is correct - it is not just Muslims, you know.

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-12   14:20:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: Tater (#31)

Are there at least 10 verses (and probably more) in the bible that pertain to killing non believers, even killing your own family member if they don’t believe in Jesus? Your Turn . . .

Is it Happy Hour so soon?

Your turn, Tater-Tot.

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-12   14:22:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: Tater (#34)

...[People] will forever deny that actually not all terrorists are Muslim.

Hey Tots - Have you forgotten that I gave a margin of .03-1% of terrorists that might NOT be Muslim?

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-12   14:25:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#37. To: Liberator, mel (#28)

The doctrine of Jesus Christ does NOT condone murder, violence, and conversion by the sword IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST...Never did; Never will.

Ahem ... Liberator -

It is quite obvious that you are a student of the Bible. Therefore, please explain the meaning of the following quoted versus and scriptures.

(I think it's pretty clear … that it's not a full-blown research effort yet, but more of a quick bit of analysis to check your hypothesis).

I am in no hurry, take your time – I can wait for this …

Kill Nonbelievers
They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)

Kill Followers of Other Religions.
If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death, because he sought to lead you astray from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery. And all Israel, hearing of this, shall fear and never do such evil as this in your midst. (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 NAB)

Kill People Who Don't Listen to Priests
Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:12 NLT)

Kill Witches
You should not let a sorceress live. (Exodus 22:17 NAB)

Kill Homosexuals
"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13 NAB)

Kill Fortunetellers
A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death. (Leviticus 20:27 NAB)

Death for Hitting Dad
Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. (Exodus 21:15 NAB)

Death for Cursing Parents
1) If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. (Proverbs 20:20 NAB) 2) All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. (Leviticus 20:9 NLT)

Death for Adultery
If a man commits adultery with another man's wife, both the man and the woman must be put to death. (Leviticus 20:10 NLT)

Death for Fornication
A priest's daughter who loses her honor by committing fornication and thereby dishonors her father also, shall be burned to death. (Leviticus 21:9 NAB)

Death to Followers of Other Religions
Whoever sacrifices to any god, except the Lord alone, shall be doomed. (Exodus 22:19 NAB)

Kill False Prophets
If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, "You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord." When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through. (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)

Kill the Entire Town if One Person Worships Another God
Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him." (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)

Kill Women Who Are Not Virgins On Their Wedding Night
But if this charge is true (that she wasn't a virgin on her wedding night), and evidence of the girls virginity is not found, they shall bring the girl to the entrance of her fathers house and there her townsman shall stone her to death, because she committed a crime against Israel by her unchasteness in her father's house. Thus shall you purge the evil from your midst. (Deuteronomy 22:20-21 NAB)

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-12   14:31:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#38. To: Tater, Liberator (#37)

What Liberator and the other thumpers will come back with is that "Those are from the Old Testament so they don't count." But remember, so did the Ten Commandments, so should we discount them as well because they're in the Old Testament?

What's the difference between Sarah Palin's mouth and other parts of her body? Only some of the things that don't come out of her mouth are retarded.

Racism_Boot  posted on  2009-12-12   14:35:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#39. To: Tater (#37)

Nice try, Tots, but THIS was your original claim:

"The Bible for One Thousand: Can you find at least 10 verses from the bible that pertain to killing non believers, even killing your own family member if they don’t believe in Jesus Christ.

Tick...tick...tick...

Liberator  posted on  2009-12-12   14:36:58 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#40. To: Liberator (#33)

Any cursory perusal of this thread is evidence of your disingenuous and intellectual dishonesty.

Your dismissal of common sense is also duly noted.

And after I studied your comments history before engaging in a discussion with you, It was easily evident for me to observe that you have problems with your overt bias - continually posting a bunch of tripe, on which I have called you out.

OriginalGatlin  posted on  2009-12-12   14:39:24 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#41. To: Liberator (#39)

The Bible for One Thousand: Can you find at least 10 verses from the bible that pertain to killing non believers, even killing your own family member if they don’t believe in Jesus Christ.

These loons still trying to push this same nutty BS.Dont you know the "Insane Murder Cult" known as Islam is just misunderstood and misrepresented.

Gater  posted on  2009-12-12   14:42:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



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