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Title: GOP Leadership’s Latest Obamatrade Ploy Revealed: Small Business Tax Hike That Violates GOP’s Anti-Tax Pledge
Source: Breitbart via Drudge
URL Source: http://www.breitbart.com/big-govern ... violates-gops-anti-tax-pledge/
Published: Jun 14, 2015
Author: Alex Swoyer
Post Date: 2015-06-14 23:32:37 by Tooconservative
Keywords: None
Views: 1931
Comments: 28

Establishment Republicans desperately trying to secure the passage of Trade Promotion Authority (TPA), which would give President Obama fast-track authority to secure congressional approval of at least three secretive trade deals, are now willing to increase taxes on small businesses in a way that would violate a pledge almost every Republican Congressman has taken when elected into office.

To secure final passage through Congress of a package that would include TPA fast-track authority—which would ensure finalization of the secretive Trans Pacific Partnership (TPP), Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership (T-TIP) and Trade in Services Agreement (TiSA), among other deals—the House would need to pass the Trade Adjustment Assistance (TAA) package that was necessary for Senate passage of TPA. The House voted TAA down 302-126 with widespread bipartisan opposition to last week, but House Ways and Means Committee chairman Rep. Paul Ryan (R-WI) and his allies in House GOP leadership have pledged that they will try to pass it again early next week. The vote would potentially be on Monday, but more likely on Tuesday—and if there is no vote by Tuesday, it’s unlikely that Ryan will be able to succeed in his ploy to revive TPA.

TAA is a big government program usually favored by Democrats—it increases the size and scope of government, and is essentially viewed by Republicans as a welfare program—so their opposition to it during Friday’s complicated and confusing House vote schedule was not opposition to TAA as a specific concept, but opposition to the full Obamatrade package, especially TPA.

House Minority Leader Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) gave a blistering floor speech against the full Obamatrade deal, causing a Democratic rebellion against TAA—and forcing Ryan to push Republicans to vote for that part of the package.

TAA was originally supposed to be financed with Medicare cuts – which sparked major outrage, and cries of hypocrisy in what would have certainly turned into boldly negative campaign advertisements against Republicans by Democrats this next cycle. But under pressure, Republican leadership, mainly Boehner and Ryan, negotiated with Democrats to remove the Medicare cuts from the financial backing of TAA and instead using direct tax hikes by raising the penalties for misfiled taxes.

“A vote for Obamatrade on Tuesday is a vote to give the IRS more power and more incentives to go after small businesses,” said Curtis Ellis, founder of the Obamatrade.com website, in an exclusive interview with Breitbart News.

Democrats overwhelmingly opposed TAA Friday after Pelosi voiced opposition to giving President Obama fast-track trade authority.

“So while I am a big supporter of TAA, if TAA slows down the fast-track, I am prepared to vote against the TAA because then its defeat, sad to say, is the only way that we will be able to slow down the fast-track,” Pelosi said just minutes before the crucial vote. She concluded: “The facts are these: If TAA fails, the fast-track bill is stopped.”

“It’s pretty outrageous what is called for in this bill that Congress is going to vote on Tuesday – it literally doubles and triples the taxes on small businesses,” explained Ellis.

Ellis spent hours researching this legislation and explained to Breitbart News how it could impact small business taxes if Congress passes the TAA during its vote on Tuesday.

“Small businesses that are already over-burdened with IRS paperwork will be penalized even further if they make a technical mistake on filing informational paperwork,” he said. “There’s a lot of dishonesty going on when the bill is described as raising the fines on tax violations. That’s dishonest because the fines aren’t for people who failed to pay their taxes, the fines are on businesses that for no fault of their own, they forget to fie a piece of paperwork telling the IRS how much someone else owes on their taxes.”

“It’s outrageous that Republicans who complain all the time – rightfully so – about the IRS’s overreach and over burdening small business are actually increasing the incentive for the IRS to spy on people – to spy on small businesses,” he added.

Essentially, as explained by Ellis, any time a small business paid an independent contractor or freelancer a commission or any tips, it must be reported to the IRS with a 1099 form, which a copy is also sent to the contractor or freelancer. If the small business is late in filing this form, then it is fined by the IRS. The proposal Tuesday, as it stands, would double and triple these fines.

“It is the height of cynicism for Congress to plan on paying for a welfare program for unions by increasing the penalties for small businesses,” Ellis reacted.

President of Americans for Limited Government Rick Manning agrees with Ellis about this increasing penalty being a tax increase on small businesses.

“There is no question that raising the penalty on small businesses who commit a paperwork error is a tax increase. It is directly intended to raise revenues, so it can’t be considered anything else. For Republican leadership to ask their members to vote to raise taxes on small business to fund a union bailout that Big Labor doesn’t want is both horrific policy and terrible politics,” Manning told Breitbart News.

This program was so unpopular with both Democrats and Republicans that they removed it from Obamacare.

“This is very similar to one of the ways Obamacare was going to be paid for – as Obamacare was enacted they were looking for revenue to pay for it by increasing the penalties on small businesses who failed to file 1099 forms – that was repealed because it was so unpopular,” Ellis said. “Republicans led the charge in repealing it and now they’re the ones leading the charge to once again increase the penalties in already burdensome paperwork for the IRS.”

Therefore, the Republicans that voted for TAA Friday, essentially voted to finance TAA at the expense of increasing small business taxes – a direct violation of the Grover Norquist tax pledge, which many Republican Congressmen took, pledging to the American public not to raise any more taxes.

Norquist, President of Americans for Tax Reform, a group for taxpayer advocacy to limit size of government, organized the Taxpayer Protection Pledge. The pledge asks all politicians for both federal and state office to sign the pledge, committing themselves to oppose tax increases.

“This is clearly a tax increase – and it’s a violation of Grover Norquist’s no tax increase pledge that most of these Congressmen signed,” Ellis said. “This legislation assumes that there are small businesses out there that will fail to file the 1099 form and will therefore have to pay a fine.”

“It assumes small businesses will be forced to pay the IRS and then it goes further and says ‘let’s make them pay more’ – it doubles and triples the fines,” he argued.

Nearly every elected Republican in America—with rare exception—has signed Norquist’s anti-tax pledge. As such, the 86 Republicans who voted to raise small business taxes through the TAA on Friday most likely did as well.

ATR spokesman John Kartch told Breitbart News he doesn’t think TAA as it’s structured now in the House is a tax and that it does not violate the tax pledge—but that ATR is vehemently opposed to the program and is recommending all Republicans vote against it. That means ATR is in agreement with other groups from a more conservative perspective—albeit for slightly different reasons—on this matter, and won’t back down to help Obamatrade across the finish line.

“The Trade Adjustment Assistance (TAA) is, like most government jobs training programs, a well intentioned, but flawed program,” Kartch said in an email on Sunday night.

“Americans for Tax Reform opposes the TAA program and any increase in funding for it. The TAA is tied to the Trade Promotion Authority designed to facilitate trade agreements that reduce tariffs. Tariffs are taxes. For most of our nation’s history our national government was largely funded by tariffs. The increases in fines for not filing 1099s are not tax hikes. Tax increases come from changes in tax law. ATR opposes the increase in the fines. Not every stupid move by government is a tax. Civil asset forfeiture is a vicious misuse of government power — but it is not a tax. Excise taxes are taxes and the bottom line of the drive to expand free trade is that — even with silly ‘bribes’ to Democrats like the TAA –freer trade driven by tariff reductions will reduce the taxes paid by American consumers and increase the nation’s economic strength. As has happened with every tariff reduction in our history.”

This is extraordinarily significant, since Norquist and his organization did support the TPA portion of Obamatrade, but the public opposition to its TAA portion means it’s unlikely any GOP votes will budge if and when leadership brings up TAA again next week. In fact, if any Republicans change their votes, they’re likely to switch from voting in favor of TAA to against it so not to violate their pledge.

Ellis, Manning and Norquist are hardly the only influential right-of-center figures opposing TAA.

“Regardless of how TAA is financed, it is a wasteful ineffective program that undermines the virtues of free trade,” Dan Holler, Communications Director for Heritage Action for America, told Breitbart News.

Heritage Action and Club for Growth – a conservative group – both oppose the TAA program saying it’s a wasteful welfare program. Heritage Action scored against TPA and TAA, but Club For Growth supported—like ATR—TPA but not TAA.

When TAA went down in the House last week, only 86 Republicans voted for it—and they were joined by just 40 Democrats.

A whopping 158 Republicans joined 144 Democrats to oppose TAA. To pass TAA this week, the only way to truly keep Obamatrade alive without having to go through a grueling conference committee strategy that would likely lead to even more lost votes on both the House and Senate side when they would vote on an eventual conference report, the establishment would need to pick up 92 votes to get to 218.

That seems highly unlikely, given that the widespread GOP opposition and the revelation that voting for this TAA portion is technically voting for a tax increase. That alone is likely to keep the 158 Republican noes in their column and probably add GOP opposition as several of the 86 GOP ayes are likely to change their votes to oppose it as Democrat opposition is getting stronger too. On Sunday, former Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton—the likely eventual Democrat nominee for president in 2016—urged Democrats to trust Pelosi and oppose granting Obama fast track trade authority until a good deal is assured.

“The president should listen to and work with his allies in Congress, starting with Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D-CA),” Clinton said in Iowa.

If TAA were to pass—which is even more unlikely now that there’s probably not going to be any Democrat or GOP defections into supporting it—then so does TPA. The bills would move on to President Obama’s desk together, giving him fast-track authority to finalize his trade deals without any amendments to his deals by Congress.

Ryan’s office has not responded to a request for comment in response to these revelations about Obamatrade’s tax increases.


Poster Comment:

I expect an explosion on the Right blogosphere and on talk radio as it sinks in what the GOP elite is planning.

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#1. To: TooConservative (#0)

Sen. Jeff Sessions blasts Obamatrade http://obamatrade.com/sen-jeff...

Mark Levin Opposes Fast Track – and Congress should, too! http://obamatrade.com/mark-lev...

Eagle Forum: No Fast Track for Obamatrade http://obamatrade.com/eagle-fo...

TheTeaParty.net: No Fast Track for Obamatrade http://obamatrade.com/theteapa...

American Family Association: No Fast Track for Obamatrade http://obamatrade.com/american...

Obamatrade: A gift for Sharia regimes http://obamatrade.com/obamatra...

Alan Keyes blasts Obamatrade and those who love it http://obamatrade.com/alan-key...

Allen West: Obamatrade is a disaster http://obamatrade.com/allen-we...

Center for Security Policy: No Fast Track for Obamatrade http://obamatrade.com/center-f...

Americans for Limited Government: No Fast Track for Obamatrade http://obamatrade.com/american...

More Power for Obama !?!? http://obamatrade.com/more-pow...

Lou Dobbs & Ed Rollins blast Obamatrade http://obamatrade.com/lou-dobb...

Sen. Jeff Sessions slams “trade” deals promoting immigration http://obamatrade.com/sen-jeff...

Obamatrade = Unrestricted Immigration http://obamatrade.com/obamatra...

Obamatrade weakens rule of law, encourages outsourcing: CATO http://obamatrade.com/obamatra...

Obamatrade destroys national sovereignty – as planned http://obamatrade.com/obamatra...

out damned spot  posted on  2015-06-15   8:18:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: out damned spot, redleghunter, Pericles (#1)

That's quite a list of opponents.

Make a similar list of the Left groups opposing (unions, the Pelosi wing of progressive Dems including the Congressional Black Caucus) and you do have a case of Right Meets Left in opposition to the free trade lobbying behemoth.

It will be interesting to watch. Paul Ryan has behaved disgracefully.

The idea that increasing (instead of decreasing) IRS fines on small business paperwork errors to pay for this TAA is insult heaped on injury by the GOP. Their original plan was to take the money out of Medicare, making it go insolvent even sooner.

Do they really think anyone elected them to do such things? All for a "pass it so you can find out what's in it" trade bill (with force of law superior to congressional and state laws)?

It's insane. The GOP are being shameless corporate lackeys. They could care less about their voters.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-06-15   8:42:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: TooConservative (#0)

"that would include TPA fast-track authority—which would ensure finalization of the secretive Trans Pacific Partnership (TPP), Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership (T-TIP) and Trade in Services Agreement (TiSA)"

Obama can finalize those agreements without fast-track authority. It would simply take longer, that's all.

misterwhite  posted on  2015-06-15   9:16:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: TooConservative (#2)

Why is the TAA tied to the TPA?

misterwhite  posted on  2015-06-15   9:20:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: TooConservative, out damned spot (#2)

Do they really think anyone elected them to do such things? All for a "pass it so you can find out what's in it" trade bill (with force of law superior to congressional and state laws)?

It's insane. The GOP are being shameless corporate lackeys. They could care less about their voters.

What's insane is Congress goes about their business with the idea they have 'money to spend.' They don't. They wave a bunch of money around thinking it is 'their' money....It's not. It's OUR money. It's like a bunch of teens telling people they can spend money on anything...but the parents earned the money.

The coffers are empty. The country is being run on IOUs to China. I guess obamatrade is 'a way' to 'pay back' our economic masters in Asia.

Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation. He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved. (Psalm 62:1-2)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-06-15   9:39:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: misterwhite (#4)

Why is the TAA tied to the TPA?

It was presented in the Senate as a package. There are several bills for TPA and TAA and another one (I think). All must pass the House or the Senate version falls apart, resulting in the Senate having to start over or trying to pass by sending it to conference committee and then have it fail due to even more dissatisfaction with it.

They can only pass these deals in secrecy. I'm not sure how that comports with the voters having a chance to be informed. It's just a wholesale sellout to a lot of deep-pocket lobbyists and tycoons. Screw the voter 'cause they've got much more important things to consider. It's appalling.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-06-15   9:40:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: misterwhite, TooConservative (#4)

Why is the TAA tied to the TPA?

Indeed. Why was it orginally tied with obamacare?

Short answer...The more poop you stuff in a sock and spray it with a few ounces of perfume, the pols think it will be easier to swallow.

It's the Potomac two step...I scratch your back....you mine. Criminals.

Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation. He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved. (Psalm 62:1-2)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-06-15   9:41:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: redleghunter (#5)

In addition to your laundry list, one of things most disturbing about this is the surrender of sovereignty to this pack of international lobbyists who rotate from lobbying to sitting as judges on trade issues.

It's like a stealth EU operation, operating in secrecy with complete unaccountability from Brussels.

This is why some people call it the Pacific Union. I oppose the idea entirely but especially with Obola and Lurch in charge of negotiations and implementation.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-06-15   9:43:10 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: redleghunter, TooConservative, out damned spot (#5)

What's insane is Congress goes about their business with the idea they have 'money to spend.' They don't. They wave a bunch of money around thinking it is 'their' money....It's not. It's OUR money. It's like a bunch of teens telling people they can spend money on anything...but the parents earned the money.

I used to think like that but in reality the USA is being funded by tribute money from her imperial satellites. I know it does not seem like the way Rome collected tribute payments of old but in the modern world tribute works by selling T-Bills at low rates of interest returns which the satellites buy up and the USA has no intention of ever paying out these "loans" which are renewed monthly.

Pericles  posted on  2015-06-15   9:43:38 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: misterwhite (#3)

Obama can finalize those agreements without fast-track authority. It would simply take longer, that's all.

The Senate still has to ratify with 67 votes. And we would know what was in it in advance.

If it is so terrific, what are they trying to hide?

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-06-15   9:44:44 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: TooConservative (#8)

This is why some people call it the Pacific Union. I oppose the idea entirely but especially with Obola and Lurch in charge of negotiations and implementation.

That's why the GOP has to distract people who think like you. It forced Buchanan out of the party but there are some still left within it that hold the old views.

Pericles  posted on  2015-06-15   9:45:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: TooConservative, misterwhite (#10)

If it is so terrific, what are they trying to hide?

It is no secret. It is like in the 90s when you called tech support or a call center of any kind and the Indians on the other end of the phone pretended they had American names and would even ask you how the weather was in your part of town, etc.

To the business owning class - aka capitalists - he American worker is a a loud mouth, egotistical and overpaid and over fed creature and what the capitalists need is cheap labor from overseas who would be happy to be exploited. Americans can always dig ditches - oh wait, those jobs go to lower waged illegals also.

Pericles  posted on  2015-06-15   9:49:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: TooConservative (#10)

"The Senate still has to ratify with 67 votes."

Yeah. It's been that way for what, 200+ years?

"And we would know what was in it in advance."

In advance of what? Voting on it? No different than a fast-track bill.

The biggest difference would be that it would be picked apart by 100 Senators, each one wanting different deletions, additions, concessions, compromises (and pork) on each and every provision in a bill running thousands of pages.

It's doubtful it would ever pass. Which is what the Democrats want.

misterwhite  posted on  2015-06-15   10:04:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: misterwhite (#13)

It's doubtful it would ever pass. Which is what the Democrats want.

As bad as it looks now and given who is negotiating for us, maybe that's what we should want too.

Remember the broken clock.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-06-15   10:05:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: TooConservative (#6)

"It was presented in the Senate as a package."

Yeah You're right. I skipped right over it.

"They can only pass these deals in secrecy."

Certainly they're negotiated in secrecy. But the TPA is simply fast-track authority and the Senate TAA was bill #568 -- open to the public (http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/114/s568/text).

Pass them in secrecy?

misterwhite  posted on  2015-06-15   10:14:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: TooConservative, GarySpFc, liberator, CZ82 (#8)

It's like a stealth EU operation, operating in secrecy with complete unaccountability from Brussels.

Next you will be quoting from Revelation:)

I agree it stinks. All the people involved have no interest in hard working small businessmen/women.

Have an Army buddy who with great financial risk opened a small business locally. It is in a deli like restaurant which serves breakfast and lunch meals. Real popular with the locals as they did not have such a 'mom and pop' operation locally for some years. He goes in to work at 4am and works his orders and makes the food for the day. Closes around 3pm and then spends the next three hours book keeping and preparing for the next day. I went in to pick up a large order for breakfast for my office...the dude had dark circles under his eyes but he loved the business. We sat down for a cup of his famous local coffee (on the house of course since we are Army buddies:)) and he told me the daily grind and that getting a chance to vacation in the summer for a week is a challenge in the food/restaurant business. Good news is business is good and he is opening up another shop on the other side of town and will have enough income to hire a few more reliable hands.

So think of this guy spending those last three hours at work and forgetting some IRS form and getting penalized. I'm sure he has an accountant which looks at his paperwork before it is submitted, but again that is another transfer cost to a small business when the process is complicated by pols in the Beltway.

Boener of all people should know the deal as his father owned his own business.

Our 'leaders' are so far removed from real Americans. They just don't get it anymore.

Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation. He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved. (Psalm 62:1-2)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-06-15   10:18:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: Pericles (#9)

I used to think like that but in reality the USA is being funded by tribute money from her imperial satellites. I know it does not seem like the way Rome collected tribute payments of old but in the modern world tribute works by selling T-Bills at low rates of interest returns which the satellites buy up and the USA has no intention of ever paying out these "loans" which are renewed monthly.

Well I think China will 'call our hand' some day as it is in their nature to have the US and the West over the barrel. That is what obamatrade is all about. Giving some appeasement to those we owe money to.

Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation. He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved. (Psalm 62:1-2)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-06-15   10:21:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: TooConservative (#14)

"As bad as it looks now and given who is negotiating for us, maybe that's what we should want too."

Pelosi wanted to pass Obamacare in order to see what was in it. You want to veto Obamatrade before seeing what's in it.

Birds. Feather.

Under fast- track, everyone in the whole world will see what's in it when they're done negotiating. Geez Louise. You'll have plenty of time to write your Congressman, organize marches and riot in the streets in opposition.

Knowing he faces an up-or-down vote on the entire package, Obama would be flat-out stupid to put in some controversial and idiotic provision that could kill the whole bill.

misterwhite  posted on  2015-06-15   10:22:12 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: redleghunter (#17) (Edited)

Well I think China will 'call our hand' some day as it is in their nature to have the US and the West over the barrel. That is what obamatrade is all about. Giving some appeasement to those we owe money to.

As long as petroleum is fixed in value to the dollar China will fail to dethrone the imperial dollar.

Pericles  posted on  2015-06-15   10:23:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: Pericles (#19)

As long as petroleum is fixed in value to the dollar China will fail to dethrone the imperial dollar.

Heh..."as long as indeed." See Deckards thread...seems the Euro powers that be want to change how we all do 'business.'

Truly my soul waiteth upon God: from him cometh my salvation. He only is my rock and my salvation; he is my defence; I shall not be greatly moved. (Psalm 62:1-2)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-06-15   10:36:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: misterwhite (#18)

Knowing he faces an up-or-down vote on the entire package, Obama would be flat-out stupid to put in some controversial and idiotic provision that could kill the whole bill.

And the number of other flat-out stupid, controversial and idiotic stuff he has done doesn't tell you he can't be trusted?

You sound like a low-info Obama voter.

Given what a disaster Obama is for the working class and the middle class, I don't see any justification for your confidence, unless you and Obama are planning to "tickle down" on the rest of us which is often what these megatrade deals amount to.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-06-15   11:03:32 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: TooConservative (#21)

"And the number of other flat-out stupid, controversial and idiotic stuff he has done doesn't tell you he can't be trusted?"

Just sayin'.

Trust has nothing to do with it. If he wants to screw up this massive trade bill with some stupid provision about small business taxes, he's gotta know it's going down.

misterwhite  posted on  2015-06-15   13:26:27 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: misterwhite (#22)

If he wants to screw up this massive trade bill with some stupid provision about small business taxes, he's gotta know it's going down.

If he negotiates even a very bad trade deal, there will be immense lobbying pressure from lobbyists and many other self-serving entities like RIAA/MPAA/Big Pharma, Monsanto, the environmentalists, etc. to ratify the resulting treaty. It'll be "it's better than nothing", "we'll lose trillions waiting to renegotiate a better treaty", "you'll lose all your re-election funding if you don't vote for this", etc. The same shallow and false arguments we heard for NAFTA and CAFTA and GATT.

It's ludicrous that you would trust a disastrously naive president like Obola, desperate for a "legacy", and Lurch, one of the most ineffective SoS in history along with Hitlery, to negotiate this deal.

The longer I look at this thing, the more it stinks.

I took the time to review the Paul Ryan interview on this yesterday. Despicable. I hope someone primaries him out of Congress. He disgusts me.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-06-15   13:36:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: TooConservative (#23)

"It'll be "it's better than nothing"

Do you expect everything in the trade bill to be exactly what you want?

People like you are reason for the need for fast-track -- without it you'd want to renegotiate, modify, twist, and amend every single line item to death. Now, maybe your intentions are good and true. But the Democrats want to kill the bill and see fast-track as an obstacle.

You're objecting to something you haven't even seen. Once it is negotiated and available to the public, THEN you can object with some modicom of credibility.

misterwhite  posted on  2015-06-15   14:05:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: misterwhite (#24)

objecting to something you haven't even seen. Once it is negotiated and available to the public, THEN you can object with some modicom of credibility.

Ya, just like healthcare.

How'd that work out?

Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2015-06-15   14:49:35 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: Dead Culture Watch (#25)

Ya, just like healthcare.
How'd that work out?

If I recall, every Republican voted against it but it still passed because the Democrats had the majority.

Why do you ask?

misterwhite  posted on  2015-06-15   14:55:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: misterwhite (#26)

Because of how secret this is, and I find it mildly amusing you trust the GOPE at all.

Dead Culture Watch  posted on  2015-06-15   21:15:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: Dead Culture Watch (#27)

"Because of how secret this is, and I find it mildly amusing you trust the GOPE at all."

Trust the GOPE? They're not the ones negotiating this trade deal. Obama is. The GOPA, B, C, D, or E has nothing to say about it. Not yet, anyways.

Now, when the trade deal is finished, it will be presented to Congress AND the public and it will be voted on.

misterwhite  posted on  2015-06-16   9:07:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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