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Title: Obama Threatened to Shoot Down Israeli Jets Attacking Iran
Source: [None]
URL Source: http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/ob ... eli-jets/2015/03/01/id/627575/
Published: Mar 1, 2015
Author: g richter
Post Date: 2015-03-01 20:24:06 by out damned spot
Keywords: Obama, Iran, Israel
Views: 20880
Comments: 102

President Barack Obama threatened to shoot down Israeli planes in 2014 if they were sent to bomb Iranian nuclear facilities, according to reports attributed to a Kuwaiti newspaper.

According to the website Israel National News, the Bethlehem-based news agency Ma'an cites Kuwaiti newspaper Al-Jarida.

Al-Jarida reports that the alleged threat from the White House forced Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to cancel the planned attack.

President Barack Obama threatened to shoot down Israeli planes in 2014 if they were sent to bomb Iranian nuclear facilities, according to reports attributed to a Kuwaiti newspaper.

According to the website Israel National News, the Bethlehem-based news agency Ma'an cites Kuwaiti newspaper Al-Jarida.

Al-Jarida reports that the alleged threat from the White House forced Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to cancel the planned attack.

An Israeli minister on good relations with the Obama administration reportedly tipped Secretary of State John Kerry to the plan and that Obama vowed to shoot down the planes when they crossed over U.S.-controlled airspace in Iraq.

Al-Jarida quoted "well-placed" sources saying that Netanyahu, Minister of Defense Moshe Ya'alon and then-Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman made the plans for airstrikes after consulting top commanders.

In addition to the attacks, Netanyahu and his ministers decided to try to thwart any nuclear deal between the United States and Iran over fears that a nuclear Iran is a threat to Israel's existence, the newspaper said.

Israeli pilots reportedly trained for weeks on the mission and even were able to fly into Iranian airspace without being detected by radar.

Israel's fears of nuclear attack are not new. In 2007, an Israeli airstrike took out a suspected nuclear site in Syria. A 1981 airstrike took out a suspected nuclear reactor in Iraq.

Israel National News quoted a Daily Beast interview from 2009 in which former President Jimmy Carter's national security adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski urged Obama to take on any threat to Iran from Israel.

"They have to fly over our airspace in Iraq. Are we just going to sit there and watch?" Brzezinski said. "We have to be serious about denying them that right. That means a denial where you aren’t just saying it. If they fly over, you go up and confront them. They have the choice of turning back or not."

Brzezinski even suggested, "No one wishes for this but it could be a Liberty in reverse."

That was an allusion to an incident in the 1967 Six Day War in which Israeli jets and torpedo boats attacked the USS Liberty in international waters. Israel later called the attack an incident of "friendly fire."

Netanyahu is set to address a joint session of Congress on Tuesday over the Iranian nuclear threat. Most Democrats have said they will not attend and Obama has said he will not meet with the prime minister since the talk will occur two weeks from Israeli elections.

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 61.

#1. To: out damned spot (#0)

" a nuclear Iran is a threat to Israel's existence "

That would be a reasonable assumption.

Stoner  posted on  2015-03-01   20:50:06 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: Stoner, out damned spot (#1)

A nuclear Iran would be a check on Sunni Muslims also. And that is also good.

Pericles  posted on  2015-03-01   20:51:14 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: Pericles, out damned spot, All (#2)

A nuclear Iran would be a check on Sunni Muslims also. And that is also good.

For how long? How long do you think it would take Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, etc. to acquire nukes of their own (if they already do not have them) once Iran gets one?

SOSO  posted on  2015-03-01   23:00:00 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: SOSO (#7)

For how long? How long do you think it would take Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, etc. to acquire nukes of their own (if they already do not have them) once Iran gets one?

The Arabs already have nukes, Pakistan is storing them for them.

Pericles  posted on  2015-03-01   23:14:15 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: Pericles (#11)

The Arabs already have nukes, Pakistan is storing them for them.

It is not too much of a stretch to think that the nukes have already been distributed given the extreme distrust within the region even among so-called tribal brethren.

SOSO  posted on  2015-03-01   23:19:29 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: SOSO (#12)

The Arabs already have nukes, Pakistan is storing them for them.

It is not too much of a stretch to think that the nukes have already been distributed given the extreme distrust within the region even among so-called tribal brethren.

So it makes perfect sense for Iran to defend itself with nukes against the Sunni Muslims and the Zionist Israelis and the Americans - just ask Qaddafi what giving up WMD did for him....

Pericles  posted on  2015-03-01   23:58:14 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: Pericles (#13)

So it makes perfect sense for Iran to defend itself with nukes against the Sunni Muslims and the Zionist Israelis and the Americans -

If you say so, Sparky. The last I checked no-one in the Mideast is threatening to wipe Iran off the map a la Iran's stated goal for Israel.

SOSO  posted on  2015-03-02   0:14:36 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#53. To: SOSO, Pericles (#14)

If you say so, Sparky. The last I checked no-one in the Mideast is threatening to wipe Iran off the map a la Iran's stated goal for Israel.

The propaganda that Iran or Ahmedinejad threatened "to wipe Iran off the map" has been thoroughly debunked.

http://www.counterpunch.org/tilley08282006.html

August 28, 2006

Is Iran's President Really a Jew-hating, Holocaust-denying Islamo-fascist who has threatened to "wipe Israel off the map"?

Putting Words in Ahmadinejad's Mouth

By VIRGINIA TILLEY

Johannesburg, South Africa

In this frightening mess in the Middle East, let's get one thing straight. Iran is not threatening Israel with destruction. Iran's president has not threatened any action against Israel. Over and over, we hear that Iran is clearly "committed to annihilating Israel" because the "mad" or "reckless" or "hard-line" President Ahmadinejad has repeatedly threatened to destroy Israel But every supposed quote, every supposed instance of his doing so, is wrong.

The most infamous quote, "Israel must be wiped off the map", is the most glaringly wrong. In his October 2005 speech, Mr. Ahmadinejad never used the word "map" or the term "wiped off". According to Farsi-language experts like Juan Cole and even right-wing services like MEMRI, what he actually said was "this regime that is occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time."

What did he mean? In this speech to an annual anti-Zionist conference, Mr. Ahmadinejad was being prophetic, not threatening. He was citing Imam Khomeini, who said this line in the 1980s (a period when Israel was actually selling arms to Iran, so apparently it was not viewed as so ghastly then). Mr. Ahmadinejad had just reminded his audience that the Shah's regime, the Soviet Union, and Saddam Hussein had all seemed enormously powerful and immovable, yet the first two had vanished almost beyond recall and the third now languished in prison. So, too, the "occupying regime" in Jerusalem would someday be gone. His message was, in essence, "This too shall pass."

[snip]

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2006/jun/14/post155

Lost in translation

Jonathan Steele
The Guardian (UK)
14 June 2006 07.49 EDT

http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/17/israeli-minister-agrees-ahmadinejad-never-said-israel-must-be-wiped-off-the-map/

Israeli Minister Agrees Ahmadinejad Never Said Israel ‘Must Be Wiped Off the Map’

By Robert Mackey
April 17, 2012 7:11 pm
New York Times

http://fair.org/extra-online-articles/lost-in-translation/

Lost in Translation

Iran never threatened to wipe Israel off the map

By Steve Rendall
FAIR (Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting)
June 1, 2012

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/did-ahmadinejad-really-say-israel-should-be-wiped-off-the-map/2011/10/04/gIQABJIKML_blog.html

Did Ahmadinejad really say Israel should be ‘wiped off the map’?

Posted by Glenn Kessler
Washington Post
at 06:00 AM ET, 10/05/2011

nolu chan  posted on  2015-03-02   20:00:52 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#56. To: nolu chan (#53)

Israeli Minister Agrees Ahmadinejad Never Said Israel ‘Must Be Wiped Off the Map’

Even at the time, it was thoroughly debunked by Farsi speakers who explained it rather thoroughly. The original remark was that Israel would fade from time. Of course, the subtext for Ahmadinejad's Iranian listeners was likely that Iran would love to do anything to hasten that day when Israel fades from time's tableaux.

But then, about half the public still thinks Saddam attacked us on 9/11. Dumbasses.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-03-02   21:53:33 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#58. To: TooConservative (#56) (Edited)

Even at the time, it was thoroughly debunked by Farsi speakers who explained it rather thoroughly. The original remark was that Israel would fade from time. Of course, the subtext for Ahmadinejad's Iranian listeners was likely that Iran would love to do anything to hasten that day when Israel fades from time's tableaux.

Yes some idiom is at play here. But then again the Mahdi Hatter gave the speech at "The World Without Zionism" conference. So context is important here:)

Given the context of the speech, the use of "wipe Israel from the map" is a fair use of idiom in interpretation.

And it was not some neocon website which attributed the idiom to Ahmadinejad's speech but:

The Iranian presidential website stated: "the Zionist Regime of Israel faces a deadend and will under God's grace be wiped off the map," and "the Zionist Regime that is a usurper and illegitimate regime and a cancerous tumor should be wiped off the map." [81]

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad_and_Israel#.22Wi ped_off_the_ map.22_controversy

The rest of the link above describes some fancy footwork used by apologists for Ahmadinejad and his apocalyptic cult.

And I'll note...this misunderstanding business and taking out of context meme reminds me of the papal apologists for Francis.

redleghunter  posted on  2015-03-03   0:01:06 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#60. To: redleghunter, TooConservative (#58)

Given the context of the speech, the use of "wipe Israel from the map" is a fair use of idiom in interpretation.

No, it has been deliberately used to create clearly false propaganda. It was used in the same sense as the USSR has disappeared from the map. References to a Zionist regime refer to a government, not a nation.

http://www.counterpunch.org/2006/08/28/putting-words-in-ahmadinejad-s-mouth/

August 28, 2006

Is Iran's President Really a Jew-hating, Holocaust-denying Islamo-fascist who has threatened to "wipe Israel off the map"?

Putting Words in Ahmadinejad's Mouth

By VIRGINIA TILLEY

Johannesburg, South Africa

[excerpt]

The most infamous quote, "Israel must be wiped off the map", is the most glaringly wrong. In his October 2005 speech, Mr. Ahmadinejad never used the word "map" or the term "wiped off". According to Farsi-language experts like Juan Cole and even right-wing services like MEMRI, what he actually said was "this regime that is occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time."

What did he mean? In this speech to an annual anti-Zionist conference, Mr. Ahmadinejad was being prophetic, not threatening. He was citing Imam Khomeini, who said this line in the 1980s (a period when Israel was actually selling arms to Iran, so apparently it was not viewed as so ghastly then). Mr. Ahmadinejad had just reminded his audience that the Shah’s regime, the Soviet Union, and Saddam Hussein had all seemed enormously powerful and immovable, yet the first two had vanished almost beyond recall and the third now languished in prison. So, too, the "occupying regime" in Jerusalem would someday be gone. His message was, in essence, "This too shall pass."

But what about his other "threats" against Israel? The blathersphere made great hay from his supposed comment later in the same speech, "There is no doubt: the new wave of assaults in Palestine will erase the stigma in [the] countenance of the Islamic world." "Stigma" was interpreted as "Israel" and "wave of assaults" was ominous. But what he actually said was, "I have no doubt that the new movement taking place in our dear Palestine is a wave of morality which is spanning the entire Islamic world and which will soon remove this stain of disgrace from the Islamic world." "Wave of morality" is not "wave of assaults." The preceding sentence had made clear that the "stain of disgrace" was the Muslim world’s failure to eliminate the "occupying regime".

For months, scholars like Cole and journalists like the London Guardian’s Jonathan Steele have been pointing out these mistranslations while more and more appear: for example, Mr. Ahmadinejad’s comments at the Organization of Islamic Countries meeting on August 3, 2006. Radio Free Europe reported that he said "that the ‘main cure’ for crisis in the Middle East is the elimination of Israel." "Elimination of Israel" implies physical destruction: bombs, strafing, terror, throwing Jews into the sea. Tony Blair denounced the translated statement as ""quite shocking". But Mr. Ahmadinejad never said this. According to al-Jazeera, what he actually said was "The real cure for the conflict is the elimination of the Zionist regime, but there should be an immediate ceasefire first."

Nefarious agendas are evident in consistently translating "eliminating the occupation regime" as "destruction of Israel". "Regime" refers to governance, not populations or cities. "Zionist regime" is the government of Israel and its system of laws, which have annexed Palestinian land and hold millions of Palestinians under military occupation. Many mainstream human rights activists believe that Israel’s "regime" must indeed be transformed, although they disagree how. Some hope that Israel can be redeemed by a change of philosophy and government (regime) that would allow a two-state solution. Others believe that Jewish statehood itself is inherently unjust, as it embeds racist principles into state governance, and call for its transformation into a secular democracy (change of regime). None of these ideas about regime change signifies the expulsion of Jews into the sea or the ravaging of their towns and cities. All signify profound political change, necessary to creating a just peace.

nolu chan  posted on  2015-03-03   1:01:48 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#61. To: nolu chan (#60)

Did you miss the part about the original translation coming from the Iranian presidential website?

Please spare me the "Zionism" vs. Jews in general meme. One only has to look at what a Palestinian rule would be for Jews. Shall we examine the Palestinian rhetoric on what they want to do with Jews?

redleghunter  posted on  2015-03-03   1:18:17 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


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