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Title: I want to have a discussion with mininggold
Source: [None]
URL Source: [None]
Published: Oct 21, 2012
Author: A K A Stone
Post Date: 2012-10-21 01:59:06 by A K A Stone
Keywords: None
Views: 17561
Comments: 39

Ok lets have a discussion. What is it that you don't like about us conservatives?

Why is it bad for taxes to be low for the people? Doesn't that give us more freedom?

Your side is for abortion being legal. Can't you understand why our side finds the act reprehensible? Are you not capable of that? Are we bad because we are against killing babies in the womb? Why is that bad?

We think people should able to own firearms. Not because we want to commit crimes or hurt people. But because we recognize that a free people must always be on guard against tyranny. You see we love our families and we want them to succeed for generations to come. So one of the things that is important is for our people to be able to own weapons in case some day the government tries to do something really bad. Some people would say we are already there or close.

Your side gets upset when someone with money speaks. Shouldn't we all be able to speak and say what we want to? You and your side say but it is a corporation. No it is a person and they have a right to speak.

Then there is the welfare state. You can't see that it is destroying us in many many ways. First off it makes people lazy. They won't work because they don't want to lose their food stamps or their welfare. Real middle income people have to pay taxes to support those people. You think that is right? Shouldn't compassion come from the heart and not the threat from government? We spend over a trillion dollars on welfare now? How can that be good? That is a trillion stolen dollars from the people who worked for it. Aren't we entitled to the fruits of our labor?

Creation. How can anyone not see that the world was created? It is self evident.

The list goes on and on.

What do you think?

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Begin Trace Mode for Comment # 32.

#17. To: A K A Stone, Liberator, rowdee, SJN, TooConservative, GarySpFc (#0)

Very well laid out.

On the welfare state. We get professed Christians who cling to the welfare state because they see it as charity. What do I say? Paul went to Greece to gather the donations of willing believers to care for Christians in need. He did not go to Caesar to petition higher taxes so Rome (not Christian) could redistribute. Seems Paul knew the score...Charity comes from willing believers, not taxes. Paul also told us to work with our hands and eat our own bread, take care of widows and orphans. Those that clearly cannot take care of themselves.

redleghunter  posted on  2012-10-23   10:30:40 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: redleghunter (#17) (Edited)

On the welfare state. We get professed Christians who cling to the welfare state because they see it as charity. What do I say? Paul went to Greece to gather the donations of willing believers to care for Christians in need. He did not go to Caesar to petition higher taxes so Rome (not Christian) could redistribute. Seems Paul knew the score...Charity comes from willing believers, not taxes. Paul also told us to work with our hands and eat our own bread, take care of widows and orphans. Those that clearly cannot take care of themselves.

And yet most "conservatives" seem to have no problem throwing money at the biggest welfare state to ever live, Israel. So.. what is it about the American people getting what the citizens of Israel already have that you hate so much?

And Paul wasn't Jesus.

mininggold  posted on  2012-10-23   11:39:20 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: mininggold (#21)

what is it about the American people getting what the citizens of Israel already have that you hate so much?

You mean having Jihadists within our borders, within mortar and rocket range?

redleghunter  posted on  2012-10-23   14:18:29 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: redleghunter (#25)

You mean having Jihadists within our borders, within mortar and rocket range?

Maybe you need to walk down any major street in Salt Lake City wearing your Christian cross. You might get the same treatment you would get doing the same in most of Jerusalem.

mininggold  posted on  2012-10-24   13:51:20 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


Replies to Comment # 32.

#36. To: mininggold, redleghunter (#32) (Edited)

"Maybe you need to walk down any major street in Salt Lake City wearing your Christian cross."

Tell us, oh wise one, what would happen if we walked down a street of 'Salt Lake City' wearing a cross? I have family who live there, Christian family who wear crosses, maybe we should warn them, after 5 decades, they should get the hell out of there! How many non Mormon's have been assaulted, maimed, and murdered because they were wearing a cross?

Do you even know a damn thing about why Mormon's do not wear a cross, beyond the blind, superstitious ignorant unfounded hate you harbor, and spread like a maglignant desease?

Mormon's don't wear crosses, but they do not stand in the way of you wearing one, if that's what you want. If you have anything (documented proof) besides this sleazy, slanderous innuendo you've posted, then provide it, post the horrible crimes this supposed tribe has committed, or show yourself for the LIAR you are!

No one is attempting to stop you from wearing a cross, least of all a Mormom, it is you who is the instigator of violence, and an oppressionist, hating a people because they don't conform to your concept of what is right, or wrong, accepted, or not accepted, in their church.

**************************************************

Why don’t Mormons wear crosses?

Gordon B. Hinckley, a previous prophet of the Mormon church, was asked by a minister why there were no crosses on or in the Mesa, Arizona Mormon temple. He answered, “I do not wish to give offense to any of my Christian colleagues who use the cross on the steeples of their cathedrals and at the altars of their chapels, who wear it on their vestments, and imprint it on their books and other literature. But for us, the cross is the symbol of the dying Christ, while our message is a declaration of the Living Christ.” (Gordon B. Hinckley, “The Symbol of Our Faith,” Ensign, Apr 2005, 2-6)

The Savior’s death on the cross was caused by the acts of men. Jesus Christ allowed them to do this, because a voluntary laying down of life was one of the requirements for an atoning sacrifice. The Mormons honor the Savior for that, and understand the extraordinary pain, suffering, and abuse He willingly endured for us. The Mormons do have pictures of Jesus on the cross, which are used in teaching lessons, but they do not wear the cross as a decoration or jewelry. It was, after all, a terribly painful moment for Jesus Christ.

Mormons also keep in mind the suffering of the Garden of Gethsemane. It was there that Jesus Christ actually took on Himself, voluntarily, the sins of the world, and suffered an agony we cannot even imagine. Selecting only the cross ignores the intense power of what happened in the Garden, and the sacrifice involved. The Savior, who had no sins of His own, and who could, therefore, have died without ever suffering the effects of sin, chose to take on not just a few, but every sin that had and would occur.

Mormons honor and revere those critical moments in our eternal lives, but we prefer to focus our attention on the living Christ. Jesus Christ rose from the dead and lives even today, acting as our mediator, and loving us. So often, people focus so much attention on the death of the Savior, they seem to forget He once lives and He lives again. The resurrected Christ is proof that He really is our Savior.

Marvin J. Ashton, a high-ranking Mormon leader, suggested part of our answer to this question is in the Bible, in the words of the Savior, Himself:

Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it. (Matthew 16:24-25.) Jesus suggested that the true measure of a Christian isn’t his jewelry, but his actions. He asked us to take up our cross and carry it, not wear it.

With this in mind, Mormons work hard to emulate the Savior’s example throughout His lifetime on earth. They seek out ways to help others who are ill, as the Savior did. They feed the hungry. They honor their families, attend their meetings, and try to represent the Savior. When they are baptized, they take on themselves the name of the Savior, and this is a powerful responsibility. They take up His cross by wearing His name well and representing Him properly.

Carrying His cross also means to teach others about him, even when they face ridicule, persecution, or even death. Most of us are not called upon to die for our faith, although some are, but all of us are called on to live for it, and that is how we carry our cross.

While Mormons have great love for the sacrifices Jesus Christ made on the cross, they try to focus the major part of their life on living worthy of those sacrifices.

SOURCE

Murron  posted on  2012-10-24 15:08:12 ET  Reply   Untrace   Trace   Private Reply  


End Trace Mode for Comment # 32.

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