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Title: Secret panel can put Americans on "kill list'
Source:
Reuters
URL Source: http://www.reuters.com/article/2011 ... killlist-idUSTRE79475C20111005
Published: Oct 6, 2011
Author: Mark Hosenball
Post Date: 2011-10-06 12:16:04 by A K A Stone
Keywords: None
Views: 58738
Comments: 91
(Reuters) - American militants like Anwar al-Awlaki are placed on a kill or capture list by a secretive panel of senior government officials, which then informs the president of its decisions, according to officials.
There is no public record of the operations or decisions of the panel, which is a subset of the White House's National Security Council, several current and former officials said. Neither is there any law establishing its existence or setting out the rules by which it is supposed to operate.
The panel was behind the decision to add Awlaki, a U.S.-born militant preacher with alleged al Qaeda connections, to the target list. He was killed by a CIA drone strike in Yemen late last month.
The role of the president in ordering or ratifying a decision to target a citizen is fuzzy. White House spokesman Tommy Vietor declined to discuss anything about the process.
Current and former officials said that to the best of their knowledge, Awlaki, who the White House said was a key figure in al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, al Qaeda's Yemen-based affiliate, had been the only American put on a government list targeting people for capture or death due to their alleged involvement with militants.
The White House is portraying the killing of Awlaki as a demonstration of President Barack Obama's toughness toward militants who threaten the United States. But the process that led to Awlaki's killing has drawn fierce criticism from both the political left and right.
In an ironic turn, Obama, who ran for president denouncing predecessor George W. Bush's expansive use of executive power in his "war on terrorism," is being attacked in some quarters for using similar tactics. They include secret legal justifications and undisclosed intelligence assessments.
Liberals criticized the drone attack on an American citizen as extra-judicial murder.
Conservatives criticized Obama for refusing to release a Justice Department legal opinion that reportedly justified killing Awlaki. They accuse Obama of hypocrisy, noting his administration insisted on publishing Bush-era administration legal memos justifying the use of interrogation techniques many equate with torture, but refused to make public its rationale for killing a citizen without due process.
Some details about how the administration went about targeting Awlaki emerged on Tuesday when the top Democrat on the House Intelligence Committee, Representative Dutch Ruppersberger, was asked by reporters about the killing.
The process involves "going through the National Security Council, then it eventually goes to the president, but the National Security Council does the investigation, they have lawyers, they review, they look at the situation, you have input from the military, and also, we make sure that we follow international law," Ruppersberger said.
LAWYERS CONSULTED
Other officials said the role of the president in the process was murkier than what Ruppersberger described.
They said targeting recommendations are drawn up by a committee of mid-level National Security Council and agency officials. Their recommendations are then sent to the panel of NSC "principals," meaning Cabinet secretaries and intelligence unit chiefs, for approval. The panel of principals could have different memberships when considering different operational issues, they said.
The officials insisted on anonymity to discuss sensitive information.
They confirmed that lawyers, including those in the Justice Department, were consulted before Awlaki's name was added to the target list.
Two principal legal theories were advanced, an official said: first, that the actions were permitted by Congress when it authorized the use of military forces against militants in the wake of the attacks of September 11, 2001; and they are permitted under international law if a country is defending itself.
Several officials said that when Awlaki became the first American put on the target list, Obama was not required personally to approve the targeting of a person. But one official said Obama would be notified of the principals' decision. If he objected, the decision would be nullified, the official said.
A former official said one of the reasons for making senior officials principally responsible for nominating Americans for the target list was to "protect" the president.
Officials confirmed that a second American, Samir Khan, was killed in the drone attack that killed Awlaki. Khan had served as editor of Inspire, a glossy English-language magazine used by AQAP as a propaganda and recruitment vehicle.
But rather than being specifically targeted by drone operators, Khan was in the wrong place at the wrong time, officials said. Ruppersberger appeared to confirm that, saying Khan's death was "collateral," meaning he was not an intentional target of the drone strike.
When the name of a foreign, rather than American, militant is added to targeting lists, the decision is made within the intelligence community and normally does not require approval by high-level NSC officials.
'FROM INSPIRATIONAL TO OPERATIONAL'
Officials said Awlaki, whose fierce sermons were widely circulated on English-language militant websites, was targeted because Washington accumulated information his role in AQAP had gone "from inspirational to operational." That meant that instead of just propagandizing in favor of al Qaeda objectives, Awlaki allegedly began to participate directly in plots against American targets.
"Let me underscore, Awlaki is no mere messenger but someone integrally involved in lethal terrorist activities," Daniel Benjamin, top counterterrorism official at the State Department, warned last spring.
The Obama administration has not made public an accounting of the classified evidence that Awlaki was operationally involved in planning terrorist attacks.
But officials acknowledged that some of the intelligence purporting to show Awlaki's hands-on role in plotting attacks was patchy.
For instance, one plot in which authorities have said Awlaki was involved Nigerian-born Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, accused of trying to blow up a Detroit-bound U.S. airliner on Christmas Day 2009 with a bomb hidden in his underpants.
There is no doubt Abdulmutallab was an admirer or follower of Awlaki, since he admitted that to U.S. investigators. When he appeared in a Detroit courtroom earlier this week for the start of his trial on bomb-plot charges, he proclaimed, "Anwar is alive."
But at the time the White House was considering putting Awlaki on the U.S. target list, intelligence connecting Awlaki specifically to Abdulmutallab and his alleged bomb plot was partial. Officials said at the time the United States had voice intercepts involving a phone known to have been used by Awlaki and someone who they believed, but were not positive, was Abdulmutallab.
Awlaki was also implicated in a case in which a British Airways employee was imprisoned for plotting to blow up a U.S.-bound plane. E-mails retrieved by authorities from the employee's computer showed what an investigator described as " operational contact" between Britain and Yemen.
Authorities believe the contacts were mainly between the U.K.-based suspect and his brother. But there was a strong suspicion Awlaki was at the brother's side when the messages were dispatched. British media reported that in one message, the person on the Yemeni end supposedly said, "Our highest priority is the US ... With the people you have, is it possible to get a package or a person with a package on board a flight heading to the US?"
U.S. officials contrast intelligence suggesting Awlaki's involvement in specific plots with the activities of Adam Gadahn, an American citizen who became a principal English-language propagandist for the core al Qaeda network formerly led by Osama bin Laden.
While Gadahn appeared in angry videos calling for attacks on the United States, officials said he had not been specifically targeted for capture or killing by U.S. forces because he was regarded as a loudmouth not directly involved in plotting attacks.
Poster Comment:
Who are these people. Someone get their names and we will make our own little list.
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#2. To: A K A Stone (#0)
The role of the president in ordering or ratifying a decision to target a citizen is fuzzy.
In point of fact, an enemy combatant who happened to be a citizen was targeted.
And there was nothing "alleged" about his AQ association. He was AQ.
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#3. To: war (#2)
So you are no on the record as not believing in innocent until proven guilty. You are not a fan of the United States Constitution.
#4. To: A K A Stone (#3) (Edited)
There is a constitutional difference between acts of war and criminal acts.
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#5. To: war, A K A Stone (#2)
What's the big deal? America killed American citizen enemy combatants before - from Confederate soldiers to American citizens serving in Hitler's military.
"This is what economic policy in the West has become--a tool of the wealthy used to enrich themselves by spreading poverty among the rest of the population." Paul Craig Roberts
#6. To: Godwinson (#5)
US volunteers in the Waffen-SS
There were some US citizens who were members of the Waffen-SS, but no unit made up of American volunteers was ever raised (despite some claims about an "American Free Corps" or "George Washington Brigade"). According to figures from the SS five US citizens served in the Waffen-SS in May 1940, but after that date no numbers are available.
Second Lieutenant Martin James Monti (born 1910 in St Louis of an Italian-Swiss father and German mother) went AWOL Oct 1944, travelled from Karachi to Naples (through Cairo and Tripoli) where he stole a F-4 or F-5 photographic reconnaissance aircraft (photo recon version of the P-38) and flew to Milan. There he surrendered, or rather defected, to the Germans and worked as a propaganda broadcaster (as Martin Wiethaupt) before entering the Waffen-SS as a SS-Untersturmführer in SS-Standarte Kurt Eggers. At the end of the war he went south to Italy where he surrendered to US forces (still wearing his SS uniform) claiming that he had been given the uniform by partisans. He was charged with desertion and sentenced to 15 years hard labour. This sentence was soon commuted and Monti rejoined the US Air Corps, but in 1948 he was discharged and picked up by the FBI. He was now charged with treason and sentenced to 25 years the following year. He was paroled in 1960.
Peter Delaney (aka Pierre de la Ney du Vair), a Louisiana born SS-Haupsturmführer in SS-Standarte Kurt Eggers who is believed to have served in Légion des Volontaires Français (LVF). He met Monti and probably arranged for him to enter the Waffen-SS. Delaney was killed in 1945.
At least eight American volunteers are known to have been killed during their service.
Numerous ethnic Germans who were born in the USA served in the Wehrmacht, for example Boy Rickmers who was born in New York and won the Knight's Cross as part of 320. Infanterie-Division on 26 March 1943.
No real attempt by the US authorities to investigate the matter and trace the volunteers was made after the war, as opposed to for example the efforts by the British.
http://www.axishistory.com/index.php?id=310
Interesting point, as the people who write history do not like to talk about these traitors.
#7. To: war (#4)
There is a constitutional difference between acts of war and criminal acts.
You make up stuff. Like separation of church and state. So I don't trust you.
Quote from the constitution some of these differences.
We have no declaration of war against anyone and surely not Yemen.
#8. To: Godwinson (#5)
What's the big deal? America killed American citizen enemy combatants before -
enemy comabants is a made up word to take peoples due process rights away.
#9. To: A K A Stone, Ferret Mike, war (#8) (Edited)
enemy comabants is a made up word to take peoples due process rights away.
All words are made up.
If the 'enemy combatant' who wore a military uniform is not applicable to the al-Qaeda situation then you can find many examples of the USA going after American nationals or citizens who were pirates or insurgents. For example the filipino Moro Muslim rebels were technically U.S. nationals during their uprising. So this is nothing new.
"This is what economic policy in the West has become--a tool of the wealthy used to enrich themselves by spreading poverty among the rest of the population." Paul Craig Roberts
#10. To: A K A Stone (#7) (Edited)
You make up stuff. Like separation of church and state. So I don't trust you.
You made that up.
I didn't make up separation of Church and State, the guy who wrote the first amendment along with those who ratified it to make it part of the USCON made it up.
Quote from the constitution some of these differences.
Article I Section 8: The Congress shall have Power To...
To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offences against the Law of Nations;
To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;
To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;
Article II Section 2:
The President shall be Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States, when called into the actual Service of the United States;
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#11. To: A K A Stone (#7)
We have no declaration of war against anyone and surely not Yemen.
Point out in the USCON where it details the steps and format that the US Congress must take and follow to authorize the POTUS to take military action.
Thanks.
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#12. To: A K A Stone (#0) (Edited)
American militants like Anwar al-Awlaki are placed on a kill or capture list by a secretive panel of senior government officials, which then informs the president of its decisions, according to officials.There is no public record of the operations or decisions of the panel... Neither is there any law establishing its existence or setting out the rules by which it is supposed to operate.
Let's see...
Secret courts...
Secret warrants...
Secret killings...
We're living in Nazi Germany.
Honest Socialism
#13. To: jwpegler (#12)
Conclusion: We're living in Nazi Germany.
When Durbin pointed that out what was your reaction?
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#14. To: A K A Stone (#0)
Who are these people.
Leftists and Statists. Like the ones who infest your forum.
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#15. To: war, jwpegler (#13)
Conclusion: We're living in Nazi Germany.When Durbin pointed that out what was your reaction?
My reaction was: Durbin can't decide whether he wants to be Hitler or Stalin.
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#16. To: Liberator (#14)
Leftists and Statists. Like the ones who infest your forum.
Yep...better go back to LP where if anyone questions your nonsense Goldi bans them for "censoring"...
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#17. To: jwpegler (#12)
Honest Socialism
HA!
That's the wet dream for Leftists: "Gee, look at the neat little rows of Capitalist and "teabagger" skulls!"
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#18. To: war (#16)
Yep...better go back to LP...
Naw. I like you and your 0bama-idolotry too much.
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#19. To: jwpegler, LF (#12)
I've done a cursory count of 13 x 45 rows of skulls. @575 skulls.
That would be Idi 0bama and Mugabe Holder's wet dream revenge of Whitey...after two minutes.
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#20. To: A K A Stone (#7)
We have no declaration of war against anyone and surely not Yemen.
0bama don't need no stinking "declaration of war." He's a Nobel Peace Prize winner, dammit! Didn't you see him receive his well-deserved (cough, hack) prize two weeks into his regime? So don't call his Yemeni and Libyan wars, "war"; Call them, "Lovefests."
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#21. To: A K A Stone, war (#3)
You are not a fan of the United States Constitution.
Well, he is, but only if it becomes subverted or suits the agenda of the current Leftist-Statist regime.
When Bush did the same thing he wuz a beddy bad man.
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#22. To: A K A Stone (#0)
If Bush had done this, the media would be demanding impeachment.
Just noting the obvious here. I honestly don't have a problem with Owe-bama offing this prick.
Proxy IP's are amusing.....lmao
#23. To: Badeye (#22)
If Bush had done this, the media would be demanding impeachment.
Thanks Boofer...DumbDubv$43 DID do it and the media cheered him...
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#24. To: A K A Stone, nolu chan, liberator, badeye (#0) (Edited)
I listen to what people say.
Remember the report entitled "Rightwing Extremism: Current Economic and Political Climate Fueling Resurgence in Radicalization and Recruitment" the Obama administration issued?
They TOLD us who their target is:
DHS/I&A assesses that lone wolves and small terrorist cells embracing violent rightwing extremist ideology are the most dangerous domestic terrorism threat in the United States.
Not al Qaeda, but "right-wing" extremists". That is who this administration is really worried about.
Who do they mean by that? Here is what the report says:
People who express dissenting political opinions about the economic downturn on the Internet
Rightwing extremist chatter on the Internet continues to focus on the economy, the perceived loss of U.S. jobs in the manufacturing and construction sectors, and home foreclosures...
People who oppose Obama's programs and policies
Rightwing extremists are harnessing this historical election as a recruitment tool. Many rightwing extremists are antagonistic toward the new presidential administration and its perceived stance on a range of issues, including immigration and citizenship, the expansion of social programs to minorities, and restrictions on firearms...
People who oppose illegal immigration
DHS/I&A assesses that rightwing extremist groups’ frustration over a perceived lack of government action on illegal immigration has the potential to incite individuals or small groups toward violence...
People who support the Second Amendment
Many rightwing extremist groups perceive recent gun control legislation as a threat to their right to bear arms and in response have increased weapons and ammunition stockpiling, as well as renewed participation in paramilitary training exercises. Such activity, combined with a heightened level of extremist paranoia, has the potential to facilitate criminal activity and violence.
People who are concerned with outsourcing jobs overseas
Rightwing extremist views bemoan the decline of U.S. stature and have recently focused on themes such as the loss of U.S. manufacturing capability to China and India, Russia’s control of energy resources and use of these to pressure other countries, and China’s investment in U.S. real estate and corporations as a part of subversion strategy.
Military veterans
DHS/I&A assesses that rightwing extremists will attempt to recruit and radicalize returning veterans in order to exploit their skills and knowledge derived from military training and combat. The FBI noted in a 2008 report... that some returning military veterans from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have joined extremist groups.
-----
History has demonstrated what the lunatic left does with their enemies.
Honest Socialism
#25. To: jwpegler (#24)
Nice to know you are against racial profiling...
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#26. To: jwpegler (#24)
They TOLD us who their target is:DHS/I&A assesses that lone wolves and small terrorist cells embracing violent rightwing extremist ideology are the most dangerous domestic terrorism threat in the United States.
Not al Qaeda, but "right-wing" extremists". That is who this administration is really worried about.
EXCELLENT post in its entirety, JW.
As per your informative post, the stated enemies list of 0bama and Holder, branded "terrorists":
People who express dissenting political opinions about the economic downturn on the Internet
People who oppose Obama's programs and policies
People who oppose illegal immigration
People who support the Second Amendment
People who are concerned with outsourcing jobs overseas
Military veterans
I'm sure LF's resient circle-jerk of Leftist 0bama-bots are NOT concerned by this blatant threat and un-constitution, dictatorial abuse of power, but instead APPLAUD it.
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#27. To: A K A Stone (#0)
Are these those death panels Palin was talking about?
#28. To: Fred Mertz, A K A Stone (#27)
Are these those death panels Palin was talking about?
Sorry to have disturbed Day 2 of your bender, Fred.
As per your usual deeeeply contemplated and provocative question, the answer is "No."
Cheers.
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#29. To: Fred Mertz (#27)
As per your informative post, the stated enemies list of 0bama and Holder, branded "terrorists":
That is so unlike you LIbby...lying about something.
First off, that "list" as you call, came from DHS not DOJ. Secondly, it is nothing more than racial profiling of potential recruits to right wing terrorist groups. You're FOR racial profiling aren't you?
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#30. To: Liberator (#29)
Ping to #29
#31. To: jwpegler (#24) (Edited)
They TOLD us who their target is: ..........
And all of this was initiated and most of the info gathered....... surprise surprise........ by the Bush administration.
Note the date on the military category... 2008... even someone as gullible as you should have been able to figure it out.
#32. To: Liberator (#26)
Military veteransDHS/I&A assesses that rightwing extremists will attempt to recruit and radicalize returning veterans in order to exploit their skills and knowledge derived from military training and combat. The FBI noted in a 2008 report... that some returning military veterans from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have joined extremist groups.
So 2008 means nothing to you..... that figures.
#33. To: jwpegler (#24)
Yep, and I gain recognition via this list multiple times from the Owe-bama administration.
Gee, why don't I like this POTUS.....
Proxy IP's are amusing.....lmao
#34. To: Badeye (#33)
Yep, and I gain recognition via this list multiple times from the Owe-bama administration.
Lone wolf?
Figured that you have no friends...
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#35. To: mininggold (#32)
The FBI noted in a 2008 report... that some returning military veterans from the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have joined extremist groups.
Define what the FBI is calling 'extremist groups' ming.
Then consider what they did to Randy Weaver and his son, and his wife.
Proxy IP's are amusing.....lmao
#36. To: war (#29) (Edited)
First off, that "list" as you call, came from DHS not DOJ.
So you're claiming 0bama and his inner-cabal of Commies and Idi Aminites had NOTHING to do with it? Only Nappy pulled the list of out her azz? LOL! They're a TEAM!
Secondly, it is nothing more than racial profiling of potential recruits to right wing terrorist groups. You're FOR racial profiling aren't you?
God knows how the US has been staving off all those "right wing" threats to the WTC and the Pentagon and DC Snipers and Ft. Hood slaughters from within all those right-wing Mosques....right, DUMMY? Uh...Never mind.
Of course I endorse racial profiling - that's exactly how law enforcement and profiling of ALL sorts works instead of wasting assets and shaking down white grammas and nuns at airports to appease PC fluffers like you.
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#37. To: Badeye (#35) (Edited)
Define what the FBI is calling 'extremist groups' ming.Then consider what they did to Randy Weaver and his son, and his wife.
I was commenting on the 2008 date in case you still can't read, so there is no need for you to misconstrue my post.
#38. To: Badeye, jwpegler, war (#33)
Yep, and I gain recognition via this list multiple times from the Owe-bama administration.Gee, why don't I like this POTUS.....
But...but...According to war, ONLY Nappy was responsible for the enemies list....er I mean "terrorist list." 0bama and Holder actually loooove their people...er I mean hate da white debil slave-holder descendants.
And anyway, 0bama has been much too busy vacationing, golfing and eating ice cream cones with Reggie Love to be bothered hatin' on Whitey, vets, conservatives, anti-baby killers, gun owners, and peeps who opposed a pro-Muzzie/Commie dictatorship.
"It's not surprising, then, they [White Pennsylvanians] get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations." ~ Comrade-in-Chief Barry Hussein 0bama
#39. To: Liberator (#38)
I'll take 'Why a filter is a good thing in this forum!' for $2,000 Alex....
Proxy IP's are amusing.....lmao
#40. To: Liberator (#36) (Edited)
So you're claiming 0bama and his inner-cabal of Commies and Idi Aminites had NOTHING to do with it? Only Nappy pulled the list of out her azz? LOL! They're a TEAM!
I'm telling you that this was something that had begun under the previous administration's DHS and was completed in early 2009 by the subsequent administration.
You're too hung up on hating those niggers who hate America to care.
God knows how the US has been staving off all those "right wing" threats to the WTC and the Pentagon and DC Snipers and Ft. Hood slaughters from within all those right-wing Mosques....right, DUMMY? Uh...Never mind.
Or FBI buildings...or abortion clinics...or abortion providers...or...
Oh...wait...
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
#41. To: Badeye (#39)
I'll take "Go Fuck Yourself Boofer" and wage all of it on the Daily Double...
/twit
Stay Hungry...Stay Foolish --Steve Jobs
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