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911
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Title: To all the morons who believe the governments story of 911. Post your links here that prove government is telling the truth. If you can find any lol
Source: libertysflame.com
URL Source: http://www.libertysflame.com
Published: Jun 11, 2006
Author: A K A Stone
Post Date: 2006-06-11 13:17:21 by A K A Stone
Keywords: None
Views: 20785
Comments: 36

Just to show we are fair. Here is a place to post video evidence or other evidence that proves the governments story. Good luck because the governments story is a bunch of bullshit for stupid people to believe.

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  


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#1. To: A K A Stone (#0)

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   15:24:48 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#2. To: All (#1)

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   15:25:21 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#3. To: All (#2)

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   15:26:12 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#4. To: All (#3)

Chronology of a nightmare

By MURRAY CAMPBELL With files from AP and Reuters Wednesday, September 12, 2001

The first plane came from the south, swooping low in the crystal blue skies over the glistening Hudson River at the beginning of what promised to be a transcendently lovely late-summer day.

It was about 15 minutes before 9 a.m. (EDT) and the 50,000 people who work in the two soaring, 110-storey towers of the World Trade Center were just beginning their workdays.

Clyde Ebanks, vice-president of an insurance company, was at a meeting on the 103rd floor of the south tower when his boss said, "Look at that!"

He turned and saw a plane go by and hit the trade centre's north tower.

The day that had started with coffee and office gossip had disappeared. Suddenly, it was replaced with a scene of horrific and exceedingly systematic destruction.

The circle of violence, what U.S. President George W. Bush called "an apparent terrorist attack," spread quickly after that first crash. For a couple of hours yesterday morning, events were happening so fast that confusion reigned about what had hit where.

This is a chronology of one of the most appalling days in human history:

8 a.m.: American Airlines Flight 11, a Boeing 767 with 92 people on board, leaves Boston's Logan Airport. It flies west for a while toward its scheduled destination of Los Angeles and then, somewhere over upstate New York, it veers sharply south toward New York City after apparently being hijacked.

It slows to about 313 knots from a top speed of about 500 knots as it nears the southern tip of Manhattan. "It's as if it were seeking a target," says Walter Kross, president of Flight Explorer, a U.S. Internet site that tracks aircraft movements. 8:45: The jet, now a guided missile pointed at the symbol of U.S. financial might, hits the trade centre's north tower somewhere around the 90th floor.

"I just heard the building rock, it knocked me on the floor," says Peter Dicerbo, who is working in the 47th-floor offices of First Union National Bank when it hits. "It sounded like a big roar, then the building started swaying, that's what really scared me."

MORE AT SOURCE

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/special/attack/pages/whathappened_article12.html

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   15:28:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#5. To: All (#4)

Cruz is getting off the elevator on the 92nd floor of the south tower when the plane hits.

He rushes to the stairwell and, as he is descending, he looks out a window to see one side of the building opposite him engulfed in flames and people jumping out.

"I saw the horror. That's when it hit me and I thought to myself "I have to get out of here.' "

When he gets to the bottom, he catches the eye of a co-worker. They exchange shaky smiles. "We're very lucky, aren't we?" she says. 9:03: A second jet swooping over the Hudson at an angle strikes the trade centre's south tower from the south, about two-thirds of the way up.

Television cameras capture the impact of United Airlines Flight 175, a Boeing 767 carrying 65 people, which left Boston for Los Angeles about 8:15 a.m., but hooked back toward Manhattan over Philadelphia.

An enormous ball of orange flames bursts from the building's north side a second after the plane hits the tower.

Witnesses report seeing people jumping out of the windows to their certain deaths.

"The minute I got out of the building, the second building blew up," says Jennifer Brickhouse, who is on an escalator near the ground floor when the first plane strikes.

"All this stuff started falling and all this smoke was coming through. People were screaming, falling and jumping out of the windows."

Lolita Jackson, who was working on the 70th floor of the south tower, has made it down to the 44th floor when the second plane hits. Ms. Jackson, who went through a 1993 terrorist bombing of the trade centre, has good reason to believe that lightning can strike twice.

"I always tell my friends that my disaster chit has already been used up," she says. 9:05: U.S. President George W. Bush, reading to children at a school in Sarasota, Fla., is interrupted by an aide who whispers in his ear. He resumes reading. 9:21: Tunnels leading into Manhattan are closed. 9:28: Bush cuts short his Florida visit and boards Air Force One. "Terrorism against our nation will not stand," he says. 9:45: A third passenger jet, American Airlines Flight 77, a Boeing 757 carrying 64 people, crashes on a helicopter landing pad beside the Pentagon, near Washington, D.C. It had left Dulles International Airport outside Washington at 8:21 a.m. for a scheduled flight to Los Angeles.

The plane is travelling so low that it clips light standards on the roads around the Pentagon and eyewitnesses report that it powers up just before impact.

The impact of the crash causes one side of the five-sided structure, the headquarters of the massive U.S. military, to collapse. 9:48: The U.S. Capitol, home to the House of Representatives and the Senate, is evacuated. 9:49: The U.S. Federal Aviation Administration grounds all flights departing from U.S. airports. 9:50: The White House is evacuated as the central part of Washington is thrown into chaos.

District of Columbia police herd bewildered pedestrians farther away from the White House as rumours abound about another hijacked plane heading for the city. Drivers looking to get out of the city quickly run red lights and speed across intersections, sending pedestrians scattering.

"We are all sitting ducks here. We can't get out of the city. If they want to bomb the city, we are all just waiting," one federal employee complains.

Authorities begin deploying troops in the capital, including an infantry regiment. The Situation Room at the White House goes into full operation.

"This is the second Pearl Harbor. I don't think that I overstate it," Republican Senator Chuck Hagel says. 9:58: A man calls an emergency dispatcher in Pennsylvania and says he is a passenger locked in a bathroom aboard United Airlines Flight 93, which had left Newark, N.J., for San Francisco at 8:43 a.m.

"We are being hijacked, we are being hijacked," he says before the line goes dead. 10:00: The trade centre's south tower collapses.

Witnesses report hearing a sucking sound and then an incredible surge of air as the floors pancake downwards.

A vast cloud of dirt, smoke and debris descends onto the streets below. Thousands of pieces of office paper drift over Brooklyn, about five kilometres away.

A man on a pay telephone near the trade centre is mobbed by people who want to use the phone to call relatives but find they can't use their cellphones.

At nearby St. Vincent hospital, doctor Stephen Stern reports that "hundreds of people are burned from head to toe."

"Everyone was screaming, crying, running, cops, people, firefighters, everyone," New York City fire marshal Mike Smith says. "It's like a war zone."

Businessmen Gabriel Ioan, shaking in shock outside nearby City Hall, says: "I just saw the building I work in come down." 10:10: United Airlines Flight 93, which has 45 people aboard, crashes in rural Somerset County, about 120 kilometres southeast of Pittsburgh.

Michael R. Merringer, out on a mountain bike ride with his wife, says he hears the plane's engines throttle up twice before the crash.

"I looked up and I saw the smoke coming up," he says.

Flight Explorer reports that the plane makes a series of "dramatic turns," taking it west of Cleveland, before before the pilot refiles his flight plan and the plane heads southeast for Washington.

"Then suddenly it went down," Kross says. 10:25: All international flights scheduled to land in the United States are diverted to Canadian airports. 10:30: The trade centre's north tower collapses. The top of the building explodes with smoke and dust as the giant communications antenna at the summit topples like a rocket in reverse. The fallout of debris blocks out the brilliant sun.

"There are no words to describe this," says CBS announcer Dan Rather, who stops talking for many long seconds. 10:50: Chaos breaks out around the Pentagon as rumours spread that a second attack plane is on its way. A fighter jet flies over the Pentagon, but no second plane appears. 11:04: The United Nations evacuates its headquarters on Manhattan's East Side. 11:18: American Airlines confirms that two of its planes have been hijacked and presumed crashed. 11:59: United Airlines reports that two of its planes have been hijacked and presumed crashed. 12:43 p.m.: Bush places the U.S. military on high alert. 12:53: At a hastily arranged news conference at Barksdale Air Force Base near Shreveport, La., Bush says all "appropriate" security precautions have been taken.

"Make no mistake, the United States will hunt down and punish those responsible for these cowardly acts," he says. 12:55: Taliban rulers in Afghanistan deny any responsibility for the attacks even though they have granted asylum to Osama bin Laden, the Saudi man who most U.S. officials believe is behind the carnage.

"What happened in the United States was not a job of ordinary people. It could have been the work of governments," says Taliban spokesman Abdul Hai Mutmaen. "Osama bin Laden cannot do this work, neither us. We are not supporting terrorism. Osama does not have the capability. We condemn this." 1:27: A state of emergency is declared in Washington. 1:44: Two U.S. aircraft carriers are deployed off the coast of New York. Five battleships are sent out to sea. 2:45: The death toll from the attacks will be "more than any of us can bear," New York Mayor Rudolph Giuliani says. He says the scene at the World Trade Center is horrific, but he adds: "The city of New York is stronger than any barbaric group of terrorists." 3:47:Presidential adviser Karen Hughes says Bush has convened a meeting of the U.S. National Security Council. 4:32: The White House announces that Bush is heading back to Washington after spending the afternoon at the Strategic Air Command headquarters at Offutt Air Force Base near Omaha, Neb. 5:03: Two U.S. officials accuse bin Laden of masterminding the day's attacks. 5:21: A third building at the trade centre, the 47-storey Building 7, collapses after being on fire since the morning. 5:57: CNN reports explosions in Kabul.

6:32: CNN reports that the White House denies the explosions in Kabul are a U.S. attack.

8:30: Bush addresses Americans in a televised speech.

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   15:37:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#6. To: TLBSHOW (#1)

Ok A plane is flying into the wtc. How does that prove that the governments story is true?

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   16:29:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#7. To: TLBSHOW (#2)

Ok there was some kind of explosion at the Pentagon. Again that photo doesn't prove the governments case. In fact pictures of the front of the Pentagon don't show any wreckage. CNN's Jamie McIntyre was at the Pentagon and said there is no trace that a plane hit the building. So again that picture doesn't do anything for the governments case. Here watch the video.

http://thewebfairy.com/911/pentagon/index.html

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   16:33:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#8. To: TLBSHOW (#3)

Ok you have a picture of a lady with dust on her.

The firemen who were there said there were bombs going off.

The video below is a controlled demolition. Compare that to the collapse of the WTC. Buildings don't just collapse straight down and fall in their own footprint without bombs going off. Here is the video

http://www.controlled-demolition.com/images/client/kingdome.mpg

After you watch the video feel free to post something making the governments case. So far all you did was make the case for an inside job.

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   16:39:08 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#9. To: TLBSHOW (#4)

The first plane came from the south, swooping low in the crystal blue skies over the glistening Hudson River at the beginning of what promised to be a transcendently lovely late-summer day.

It was about 15 minutes before 9 a.m. (EDT) and the 50,000 people who work in the two soaring, 110-storey towers of the World Trade Center were just beginning their workdays.

Clyde Ebanks, vice-president of an insurance company, was at a meeting on the 103rd floor of the south tower when his boss said, "Look at that!"

He turned and saw a plane go by and hit the trade centre's north tower.

The day that had started with coffee and office gossip had disappeared. Suddenly, it was replaced with a scene of horrific and exceedingly systematic destruction.

Ok a plane flew into the WTC. I think we can agree on that one. So who did it and where is the proof for them doing it?

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   16:40:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#10. To: TLBSHOW (#4)

The circle of violence, what U.S. President George W. Bush called "an apparent terrorist attack," spread quickly after that first crash. For a couple of hours yesterday morning, events were happening so fast that confusion reigned about what had hit where.

This is a chronology of one of the most appalling days in human history:

8 a.m.: American Airlines Flight 11, a Boeing 767 with 92 people on board, leaves Boston's Logan Airport. It flies west for a while toward its scheduled destination of Los Angeles and then, somewhere over upstate New York, it veers sharply south toward New York City after apparently being hijacked.

It slows to about 313 knots from a top speed of about 500 knots as it nears the southern tip of Manhattan. "It's as if it were seeking a target," says Walter Kross, president of Flight Explorer, a U.S. Internet site that tracks aircraft movements. 8:45: The jet, now a guided missile pointed at the symbol of U.S. financial might, hits the trade centre's north tower somewhere around the 90th floor.

"I just heard the building rock, it knocked me on the floor," says Peter Dicerbo, who is working in the 47th-floor offices of First Union National Bank when it hits. "It sounded like a big roar, then the building started swaying, that's what really scared me."

Ok again that doesn't prove who did anything. All it proves is those planes were up there way to long for there not to have been some kind of inside job. Someone didn't want those planes intercepted. I mean how long did they fly around for an hour or so. So again you have made the case for an inside job. Do you think the Generals and people who run our country take orders from Osama. Or is it more realistic that it was an inside job. Afterall weren't there exercises going on on 911 that were simulating attacks on the WTC. I know you remember those stories. They probably ran those operations simutaneously with operation 911. That way they could fool the people in charge of Americas defense into not responding.

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   16:44:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#11. To: TLBSHOW (#5)

An enormous ball of orange flames bursts from the building's north side a second after the plane hits the tower.

So in other words most of the jet fuel was burned in a giant fireball, yet that tower still fell first. That's a good one....lol

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   16:45:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#12. To: A K A Stone (#11)

PROVE IT WASN'T! :>)

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   16:46:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#13. To: TLBSHOW (#5)

The impact of the crash causes one side of the five-sided structure, the headquarters of the massive U.S. military, to collapse. 9:48: The U.S. Capitol, home to the House of Representatives and the Senate, is evacuated. 9:49: The U.S. Federal Aviation Administration grounds all flights departing from U.S. airports. 9:50: The White House is evacuated as the central part of Washington is thrown into chaos.

LOL...All this is going on and Bush is sitting there reading my pet goat. That's another good one. It makes the case that Bush wasn't worried. He just sat there and sat there. Here watch the video http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/bush-911.mov

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   16:47:42 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#14. To: TLBSHOW (#4)

The circle of violence, what U.S. President George W. Bush called "an apparent terrorist attack,"

So you believe Bush now huh?

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   16:48:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#15. To: TLBSHOW (#12)

PROVE IT WASN'T! :>)

What do you mean?

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   16:50:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#16. To: A K A Stone (#0)

Here is a place to post video evidence or other evidence that proves the governments story.

. . . . . . .

itisa1mosttoolate  posted on  2006-06-11   17:39:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#17. To: itisa1mosttoolate (#16)

. . . . . . .

good point.

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   17:52:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#18. To: A K A Stone (#14)

So you believe Bush now huh?

i only see the truth and the truth is God ain't happy with the good old USA

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   17:55:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#19. To: TLBSHOW (#18)

Is Jamie McIntyre telling the truth?

http://thewebfairy.com/911/pentagon/index.html

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-11   19:36:58 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#20. To: A K A Stone (#19)

DUST TO DUST - WATCH THE VIDEO

http://www.break.com/index/ concreteplane.html

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   20:08:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#21. To: A K A Stone (#19)

http://securingamerica.com/ccn/node/6162

Posted by Sandy on May 21, 2006 - 3:28pm.

Since the "newly released" frames of the Pentagon on 911,

Jamie McIntyre has been saying that he was there and there was wreckage of the "plane."

This is what he said from the Pentagon that day:

• 9/11 - CNN correspondent Jamie McIntyre reporting live from the Pentagon says that there's no evidence of a plane having crashed anywhere near the building.

Å8; Jamie Mcintryre, CNN correspondent

"From my close-up inspection, there's no evidence of a plane having crashed anywhere near the Pentagon. The only site, is the actual side of the building that's crashed in. And as I said, the only pieces left that you can see are small enough that you pick up in your hand. There are no large tail sections, wing sections, fuselage, nothing like that anywhere around which would indicate that the entire plane crashed into the side of the Pentagon and then caused the side to collapse. Even though if you look at the pictures of the Pentagon you see that the floors have all collapsed, that didn't happen immediately. It wasn't until almost about 45 minutes later that the structure was weakened enough that all of the floors collapsed." - CNN

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   23:33:30 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#22. To: A K A Stone (#19)

Is Jamie McIntyre telling the truth?

God only knows

http://www.cnn.com/2006/EDUCATION/05/16/transcript.wed/index.html

JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SENIOR PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: The tapes are a more complete and unedited version of five still frames CNN obtained from a Pentagon security camera and was the first to broadcast back in March of 2002. The newly- released video includes a view from a second camera at the same checkpoint, which provides a slightly clearer view of the American Airlines 757 as it flew just feet above the ground, and slammed into the Pentagon. One video shows the nose of the plane as it enters the frame, the other shows the fuselage as it whizzes by at several hundred miles per hour.

The tapes were sealed as evidence for the criminal trial of 9/11 conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui, but with his sentencing, the Justice Department released the tapes in response to a Freedom of Information lawsuit filed by the legal watchdog group Judicial Watch:

TOM FITTON, JUDICIAL WATCH, PRESIDENT: We wanted to help put to rest conspiracy theories suggesting it was something other then a plane that hit the Pentagon, that it was a missile or a decoy of some type.

MCINTYRE: Until now this single frame -- was the only image that showed the jetliner before it hit the Pentagon, and the image is so indistinct, that it helped fuel conspiracy theories that abound on the Internet despite pictures of the wreckage and eyewitness accounts:

MIKE WALTER, EYEWITNESS: I looked off, you know, looked out my window, and I saw this plane, a jet, American Airlines jet coming, and I thought this doesn't add up. It's really low.

MCINTYRE: The Web sites often take statements out of context, such as this exchange from CNN in which I -- myself -- appear to be questioning whether a plane really hit the building: From my close-up inspection, there's no evidence of a plane having crashed anywhere near the Pentagon. In fact, I was answering a question based on a eyewitness account who thought the American Airlines plane landed short of the Pentagon. I was indicated there was no crash site near the pentagon only at the Pentagon

MCINTYRE AUDIO: The only site is the actual site of the building that's crashed in, quote 'the actual site of the building that's crashed in.'

MCINTYRE: In fact there were thousands of tiny pieces of the plane, and I personally photographed a piece of the fuselage and what appeared to be part of the cockpit.

McINTYRE: The video isn't clear enough to convince the most ardent conspiracy theorists and there's still some mystery that surrounds the day. For instance, what happened to video from a hotel security camera nearby that sources tell CNN caught at least part of the attack. No one in the government even acknowledges that tape exists. Jamie McIntyre, CNN, the Pentagon.

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   23:37:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#23. To: All (#22)

http://www.questionsquestions.net/blog/050225pentagon_cnn.html

In fact, there's no revelations here, nothing new -- McIntyre's spontaneous observations about the scene at the Pentagon are actually very consistent with the testimony of a number of witnesses who said they saw the 757 impact. Namely, how the plane disintegrated into the building upon impact, how the wreckage was pulverized into small pieces (which has happened to planes in other documented cases, such as the sandia labs test crash of an F-4 fighter that is referenced by Jim Hoffman and others), and how some of them were surprised by the counterintuitive lack of big debris outside. Many of them were very specific and emphatic about this, and it's not surprising that someone who saw the scene afterwards could have impressions like McIntyre's. We've all already had the same impression from looking at various post-crash photos anyway.

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-11   23:41:36 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#24. To: TLBSHOW (#23)

In fact, there's no revelations here, nothing new -- McIntyre's spontaneous observations about the scene at the Pentagon are actually very consistent with the testimony of a number of witnesses who said they saw the 757 impact.

Thats full of shit. McIntyre said NO WRECKAGE. Scroll back up and watch the video.

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-12   2:19:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#25. To: A K A Stone (#24)

oops ---

MCINTYRE: The Web sites often take statements out of context, such as this exchange from CNN in which I -- myself -- appear to be questioning whether a plane really hit the building: From my close-up inspection, there's no evidence of a plane having crashed anywhere near the Pentagon. In fact, I was answering a question based on a eyewitness account who thought the American Airlines plane landed short of the Pentagon. I was indicated there was no crash site near the pentagon only at the Pentagon

MCINTYRE AUDIO: The only site is the actual site of the building that's crashed in, quote 'the actual site of the building that's crashed in.'

MCINTYRE: In fact there were thousands of tiny pieces of the plane, and I personally photographed a piece of the fuselage and what appeared to be part of the cockpit.

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-12   8:26:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#26. To: A K A Stone (#24)

any hoot jami was your witness s0 best check for truth before using someone that supports the fact that a plane went down -

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-12   8:28:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#27. To: A K A Stone (#24)

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/blogs/content/shared-blogs/washington/washington/entries/2006/06/11/earth_calling.html

are you posting from the kos convention?

TLBSHOW  posted on  2006-06-12   8:32:44 ET  (1 image) Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#28. To: TLBSHOW (#26)

Just watch what he said in the video. Before he was got to. Look at the entrance photo the the pentagon. The hole is to small. Planes don't discentegrate into little small pieces. Look at some plane crash wreckage.

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-12   8:45:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#29. To: All (#0)

Still no one posted any proof whatsoever that makes the governments story believable.

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-06-15   21:50:17 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#30. To: All (#0)

All this time and still not one shred of proof for the govenments TALL TALE!

A K A Stone  posted on  2006-09-13   0:04:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#31. To: A K A Stone (#8)

The firemen who were there said there were bombs going off.

... and handclaps can sound like gunfire ...

So what is your point with that response?

Noises, made by the floor trusses failing under excess tension or compression with their embedded concrete floor slabs would explain all that.

Why did they collapse?

by Eduardo Kausel Professor of Civil & Environmental Engineering, MIT

From an engineering point of view, there were three causes to the massive structural damage that led to ultimate failure. These are the impact of the aircraft, the subsequent fireball, and most importantly, the raging fire caused by the vast amounts of jet fuel carried by the planes.

Burning fuel must have also cascaded down floor openings to the levels below. It has been reported that the towers were designed for the impact of a Boeing 707 aircraft then flying the skies. Considering that one of the towers survived for at nearly an hour, and the other almost two hours before collapsing, this demonstrated crash resistance provides compelling validation to this claim. It has also been opined by some that the towers did ultimately fail because the 767 is a far bigger jet carrying much more fuel than the design 707 aircraft. This view is largely incorrect. The takeoff weight of a fully loaded Boeing 707-320 is 151 tons (336,000 lbs.), and it carries a fuel load of 87,000 liters (23,000 gallons) of jet fuel.

By contrast, the maximum takeoff weight of a Boeing 767-200 is some 178 tons (395,000 lbs.), and carries a fuel load of 91,000 liters (24,000 gallons). Assuming that jet fuel weighs like kerosene, this represents some 74 tons (164, 000 lbs.) of fuel, or about half the weight of a fully loaded aircraft. Thus, while the 767 is indeed a somewhat larger aircraft, it is not significantly so, while its amount of fuel load is nearly the same as in the 707. In addition, both ill-fated planes were only lightly loaded with passengers, and their fuel tanks at the moment of impact have been estimated to be no more than 50% full. Therefore, these planes did not carry their full takeoff load, but weighed instead no more than some 136 tons each. Thus, the buildings may indeed have been designed for the impact load caused by a commercial airliner the size of a Boeing 767, lost in fog in its approach to Kennedy Airport at landing speeds and with a modest fuel load remaining in its tanks. However, the designers never imagined a terrorist act during which high speed planes carrying large amounts of fuel would be deliberately crashed onto the towers, causing massive initial damage and triggering uncontrollable infernos.

From information publicly available, it is known that the weight of each building was carried by an inner core of columns surrounding elevator shafts and stairways, and by a dense lattice of external columns spaced 99cm (39 inches) on center forming an outer tube intended principally to prevent the building from overturning when subjected to strong lateral forces, such as those elicited by hurricane winds. The floors where supported by a grid of truss beams that carried the weight of the floors to the columns, while the floors in turn provided lateral support that prevented buckling of the columns.

The North Tower was hit at 8:46 above the 96th floor by a Boeing 767-200 flying at 691 km/hr (429 mph), and remained erect until 10:28, that is, nearly two hours after initial impact. By contrast, the South Tower was hit at 9:03 above the 80th floor by another 767-200 flying at 810 km/hr (503 mph) and collapsed less than an hour later at 9:59. The damage to the latter was more severe, perhaps because the second plane traversed the building at an angle and blew off external columns on two adjacent faces. This asymmetry, combined with the greater weight of the 31 stories above the crash elevation led to some tilting of the upper portion down the damaged corner, causing large overturning forces in the remaining members of the floor.

The initial impact of the aircraft caused massive structural damage to the external columns, to the floors in the proximity of the impact, and to the inner core. The ensuing fireball must have exacerbated significantly this damage, possibly collapsing locally several floors, and setting the buildings ablaze in a virtually uncontrollable, fierce fire. Still, both buildings survived this initial assault, and did not give way for a remarkably long period of time after the crash. This extraordinary capability allowed many lives to be saved, and is a major credit to the designers.

Ultimately, however, the intense fire heated the structural steel elements well beyond the thermal limit of some 400°C (750°F), which caused the steel to lose both its stiffness and resistance, and as supporting members gave way, the final failure of the building was initiated.

Various mechanisms may have been at play in this failure. Witnesses who escaped the buildings in time reported seeing large cracks develop on the (non-structural) walls of the staircases. This suggests a steady redistribution of vertical forces and propagation of structural failure down the building. However, the immediate failure mechanism was almost certainly initiated locally at the elevation of the crash. Truss beams heated by the fire were probably more vulnerable than columns, and may have been the first to go. As parts of the floors then collapsed and rained down onto the floors below, the weight of the accumulating debris steadily increased beyond the support capacity of those floors, and they collapsed in turn.

At the same time, local collapse of the floors caused the heat-weakened columns to loose their lateral support, which under the intense weight of the floors above the level of the fire caused them to buckle, break and roll out like matchsticks. At that point, the upper floors began to fall wholesale onto the structure below, and as they gained momentum, their crushing descent became unstoppable.

Indeed, with two fairly simple dynamic models I developed in the hours following the collapse, I determined that the fall of the upper building portion down the height of a single floor must have caused dynamic forces exceeding the design loads by at least an order of magnitude (i.e. more than 10 times the weight of the upper floors). Thus, there was no way in the world that the columns below could have taken this large overload, and as these gave way, an avalanche down the building ensued causing the 110 story towers to collapse in about 12 seconds in what was practically a free fall. As reported by witnesses, the crushing of one floor onto one another caused a ratchet-like noise, whose frequency can be estimated to have been around 9 Hz (=110/12).

_Jim  posted on  2007-07-22   1:54:55 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#32. To: _Jim (#31)

Lots of catching up to do now. I will get back to this later. Thanks for the response. Give me til end of week.

A K A Stone  posted on  2007-07-23   17:26:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#33. To: _Jim (#31)

and handclaps can sound like gunfire

Not really.

I will believe the fireman who WAS there not some guy on the internet with no facts to back him up.

A K A Stone  posted on  2007-07-27   20:31:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#34. To: A K A Stone (#33)

I will believe the fireman who WAS there not some guy on the internet with no facts to back him up.

There are those that think you're just a 'bot, too, Stone.

And there are others who think you are living on some other 'plane' (or dimension) if not in some alternate timeframe; you don't seem to use the same set of physical 'rules' (physics) we use here on earth in the year 2007.

Did you flunk out of your physical-sciences classes in school?

What does your periodic table (periodic chart) of the elements look like?

Have you guys discovered the elementary components of the atom yet?

_Jim  posted on  2007-07-27   23:11:11 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#35. To: A K A Stone (#33)

I want to introduce this into the record because I believe this gets at the root of the 'problem'. From: http://www.gnn. tv/A02578

9-11 and the New Pearl Harbor (Part II)
Sun, 24 Sep 2006 22:43:11

By Bill Weinberg
How wild 9/11 conspiracies undermine the left

CRITICAL INQUIRY VS. CONSPIRANOIA

Conspiracies exist. Watergate and the Iran-Contra scandals were conspiracies. More to the point, history reveals the contrivance of the 1964 Tonkin Gulf incident, the fabrication of Polish incursions against Germany in 1939, and the deception of the Reichstag fire in 1933 as real conspiracies. But the 9-11 buffs too frequently seem to buy into not merely conspiracies but what has been called "the conspiracy theory of history" -- the notion that an all-powerful hidden elite constitute the fundamental motor of human events.

This error is evidenced in the "Essential Truth" flyer's depiction of elite conspiratorial designs as "the root causes of war and injustice." This is nearly a reversal of reality. "Root causes" have to do with political economy -- the unjust social order which requires war and deception to maintain itself, and breeds terrorism. It is the conspiracies which are mere symptoms.

Reversing the equation leads the conspiracists into a number of logical errors and outright deceptions (if self-deceptions) of their own.

...

WATCH OUT... YOU MIGHT GET WHAT YOU'RE AFTER

The most sinister thing about the conspiracists is how they abet the consolidation of the very police state they claim to oppose. Arguing that Bush and his spies should have been omniscient enough to stop the attacks, they decry how the attacks are being used to expand the government's powers?blissfully unaware of how they give their own adversaries propaganda on a silver platter. With their implicit demands for an omniscient government, they (presumably unwittingly) play into the hands of those who seek a perfectly "secure" world in which privacy and personal liberty have been perfectly eliminated.

MORE - see link above

_Jim  posted on  2007-07-27   23:59:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#36. To: _Jim (#34)

Did you flunk out of your physical-sciences classes in school?

It took the wtc 10 seconds to fall. That is free fall. No resistance. You don't think they floors would have resisted at all.

It is you that lives in another dimension. Take your blinders off.

A K A Stone  posted on  2007-07-28   8:33:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


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