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Title: 'American Sniper': Prominent Libertarian Claims There Is No Difference Between Chris Kyle and Mass Murderer Adam Lanza
Source:
http://www.hngn.com/
URL Source: http://www.hngn.com/articles/65352/ ... ce-between-chris-kyle-mass.htm
Published: Jan 31, 2015
Author: ida Ahmed
Post Date: 2015-01-31 15:56:37 by Gatlin
Keywords: None
Views: 80221
Comments: 315
A prominent libertarian activist has made controversial comparisons between the late "American Sniper" protagonist Navy SEAL Chris Kyle and mass murderer Adam Lanza, who killed 28 people in a 2012 shooting spree. Lanza isn't much different from Kyle, a Navy SEAL sniper who killed 160 people during multiple combat tours in Iraq, Sheldon Richman, vice president of the Future of Freedom Foundation, said on Wednesday. Two years ago, Lanza shot his mother to death, then proceeded to a nearby Sandy Hook Elementary School and killed 20 first-graders and six staffers before committing suicide. "Excuse me, but I have trouble seeing an essential difference between what Kyle did in Iraq and what Adam Lanza did at Sandy Hook Elementary School. It certainly was not heroism," Richman wrote in an op-ed published on the Future of Freedom Foundation website and reprinted by Reason.com. "Despite what some people think, hero is not a synonym for competent government-hired killer," he added. Speaking about the widely debated Clint Eastwood's movie, Richman slammed Kyle's actions, Breitbart reported. "Let's recall some facts, which perhaps Eastwood thought were too obvious to need mention: Kyle was part of an invasion force: Americans went to Iraq. Iraq did not invade America or attack Americans. Dictator Saddam Hussein never even threatened to attack Americans," he continued. "Contrary to what the George W. Bush administration suggested, Iraq had nothing to do with the attacks on Sept. 11, 2001. Before Americans invaded Iraq, Al Qaeda was not there. Nor was it in Syria, Yemen, and Libya." "Wars of aggression, let's remember, are illegal under international law. Nazis were executed at Nuremberg for waging wars of aggression." "The only reason Kyle went to Iraq was that Bush/Cheney & Co. launched a war of aggression against the Iraqi people," he wrote. The deceased sniper cannot be deemed a hero because the American military personnel's lives that he was protecting were the aggressors themselves, according to Richman, Newsmax reported. "What American lives? The lives of American military personnel who invaded another people's country, one that was no threat to them or their fellow Americans back home." If "an invader kills someone who is trying to resist the invasion, that does not count as heroic self-defense; the invader is the aggressor. If anyone's the hero, it's the latter," he wrote. The people who Kyle killed on the battlefield only threatened Americans because "American forces waged an unprovoked war against them," he added. "No Iraqi asked to be killed by Kyle, but it sure looks as though Kyle was asking to be killed by an Iraqi. [Instead, another vet did the job.
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#210. To: Fred Mertz (#205)
Hit your head on a tomahawk again?
“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”
But a military sniper is a military asset and few object to using snipers or choppers or artillery or any other means to wipe out an enemy sniper. Yes artillery is now considered precision fires. Most of our munitions are GPS or laser guided. The munitions can also be adjusted for yield. In Iraq in one city we had a sniper problem. We used a low yield 155mm round to kill the sniper on top of a building without damaging the apartments below the roof. Jihadis use civilian population centers to wage their war so we have to find the weapon with the least collateral effect. And in some cases that would be a sniper.
"Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools " (Romans 1:21-22)
I hear ignorance shouting from the rooftops. There is a major difference between moving and still targets, and good troops keep moving to present the sniper with poor shots. Modern day snipers are hunted with a vengeance, and getting into position is a major problem for them.
“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org
Special Ops are called the "Quiet Professionals." and he broke the code. You have mistaken his silence in certain areas as lying.
“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org
I can understand and respect why you did. There were, however, radiological materials still at Tuwaitha before ground forces arrived. I don't remember the exact materials, but hundreds of HAZMAT 55gal barrels were found empty, and many looted and found in homes later. The site was sealed and guarded. Medical teams monitored and tested soldiers who came in contact with the site or barrels. Some in my old unit are still tracked. The leukemia occurrence increase for the civilian population near the site increased a few years later. They found that some of the looters took the barrels emptied them and stored water and milk in them.
"Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools " (Romans 1:21-22)
By the time of the Gulf War, valor awards required witness statements.
"Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools " (Romans 1:21-22)
Today you see the SEALs plucking off the top recruits across the services. They should all be Army or Marines. Personally, I'd just expand the Army Rangers and put all the SEALs under them. They could have a special program for UDT-qualified operators. And the Navy could keep their own UDT specialists. Rangers, Special Forces and SEALS have different missions, with major differences. SEALs should be part of the Army special forces. No, no, no. Leave the Marines as a separate branch of the Navy, just out of tradition.
“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org
The SEALS were in the Army jump school at Benning with me. I did not go through SEAL training. They opined on how easy airborne school was compared with their BUDs and scuba school.
"Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools " (Romans 1:21-22)
I don't think I could have done what they do, didn't/don't have the patience.
“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”
The drop rate was approximately 35 to 40% AT Benning IN 1963.
“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org
We did give SEALs a land mission which they hardly in the past performed. Their was some discovery learning early in Afghanistan. The author of "Not a good day to die" points this out. However the Navy pushed for a land fight. All about who gets the dough.
"Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools " (Romans 1:21-22)
If you never read any of his posts, why did you bring him up? "The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts
It was from a series of conversations I've had in the past with tpaine.
“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”
Agreed. When I went to jump school, (Ft Campbell 1955) it really wasn't that bad. -- If memory serves, we had less than a 5% drop out rate. It may have been higher in our whole class. -- I went through with my advanced basic platoon, and we only had a few drop out. I was surprised how many dropped when we were on the line in Germany. Quite a few stopped after 10/15 jumps and got jobs in leg outfits.
Really? He's been unsuccessfully stalking me (among others) for the last 15+ years.
"The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts
So has he found Roscoe?
“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”
He already broke the SEAL code that there is no such thing as a one-man operation. He did it to grab money and fame. So exactly what is restraining him to still obey any part of it? He is lying about something big involving the bin Laden raid. And it will come out, sooner or later. Other SEALs, more respectful of the code, dispute his accounts but won't break the code. But it will come out.
Not exactly. I don't live there anymore.
"The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts
Really? He's been unsuccessfully stalking me (among others) for the last 15+ years. ---- Palmdale Bullshit. Misterwhite/robertpaulsen and I used to go at it quite a bit at FR, and poor roscoe defended poor paulsen with what he thought were 'snappy one liners'. --- In actuality, they were sappy. Ever since, he's been on my case with the usual crap.
Of course. The UN had put seals on them and transporting them was forbidden. Saddam was obeying the UN. Of course. They wanted the barrels to store drinking water, anticipating that the invasion would lead to water shortages, a very serious matter in a desert country. Happens especially often when you ingest contaminated food and fluids.
Which is why I would prefer to see SEALs under Army control. Or set up one single special forces division. But, other than the rare underwater demolition job, every mission that all these operators carry out are some variety of land mission. Not naval, not air. So they belong with the Army. This kind of interservice rivalry has always been expensive and destructive. Congress should take firm action and correct the situation, once and for all.
There is as much rivalry, jealousy, envy, selfishness and clamoring for power in Congress as there is in the military.
You're not cheering me up any yet. : )
There must be dozens of Roscoe's.
“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”
Kinda like the old Kilroy bit from WW II and Korea.
You really don't have a clue what you're discussing. SEALS and Special Forces are very different from Marines and Rangers. As but one example, the medic in these units are far better trained than registered nurses, and can even perform some surgical operations.
“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org
Ventura was never a SEAL, but was in a UDT unit.
“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org
The fact that Ventura tells this story proves he lied.
“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org
Pete, you are aware they receive the same advanced training as SF after jump school, and that's at Bragg and SH.
“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org
Looks like he's about to hang himself again.
“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”
I have to defer to your expertise. I just don't follow the retreads and zombies and newbs very closely. People have to hang around for a while for me to notice much.
The "Quiet Professionals Code" is the same for SF and SEALS. BTW, He donated all monies from his book.
“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org
It was an unauthorized book. His SEAL colleagues, inasmuch as they spoke, disputed his account and said he shouldn't have written it. Not one defended his book. And there are various ways to profit from something. I would have to see proof that he did not profit indirectly from the book before I believe it. Even so, he seems to have launched a very lucrative career as a speaker, trading on his reputation as bin Laden's killer. Why else would anyone want him? Fees range from $10K to $75K and up. You can book him to speak at your event here. He sure seems to be intent on cashing in on his fame. And I think it is obvious he is lying about something. Something big.
Okay. Which one were you talking about?
"The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts
I say you're lying. "It’s a strange place I find myself these days, in my late 30s, and faced with the reality of friends, SEAL brothers, lost and gone from my life. The most recent include my friend Chris Kyle, who was killed last month, and Glen Doherty, who died six months earlier... Chris took no pleasure in taking lives as a sniper, and he doesn’t deserve the criticism that some, including Representative Ron Paul of Texas, have leveled at him. He did what his country asked of him, and did it well. His family also sacrificed greatly and deserved a moment of dignity in his death. As citizens we all share some responsibility for what this country does to defend and protect its borders. After life in the SEALs, Chris donated profits from his book, “American Sniper,” to a charity started by the mother of a fallen teammate, Marc Lee, America’s Mighty Warriors." Brandon Webb is a former Navy SEAL, author of a memoir, “The Red Circle,” and editor in chief of Sofrep (Special Operations Forces Report). "The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts
God, you are such a moron. We were discussing Robert O'Neill, not Chris Kyle. So before you jump in with both feet in your mouth, maybe you should work on your reading comprehension.
You always lie. "The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts
After you made a false accusation due to your poor reading habits, that is quite funny. Thank you, Mr. Projection.
You're caught lying and your defense is that you were lying about somebody else. That's pathological. "Colleagues confirm that Robert O'Neill fired shots killing Bin Laden..." But you won't retract your lie about Robert O'Neill, will ya?
"The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts
I wasn't lying. I was accurately conveying many news stories. You are the one desperately grasping at your own fabrications as they crumble before you. What a sad pathetic specimen you are. What else ya got, Sparky?
We all know the Iraq war was based on good ole American truths.
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#211. To: TooConservative, Pericles, GarySpFc (#117)
Certainly. I wouldn't be surprised if that still happens, especially in the Iraq occupation.
#212. To: TooConservative (#110)
As for your description of the sniper-scout, are they actually any braver than our ordinary infantry who go door-to-door in sweeps in a hostile town? I don't think so.
#213. To: TooConservative (#114)
You see the controversy with many SEALs saying that these SEALs writing books about the bin Laden raid are no longer welcome at SEAL reunions and hangouts. The guy who claims (disputed) that he shot bin Laden is an example. I can tell by watching his interviews that he is lying about something big but we'll probably never find out what it was.
#214. To: TooConservative, GarySpFc (#144)
But I turned against it when the lies were exposed by the findings at al-Tuwaitha, Saddam's nuclear reservation. The article is by a team from Texas Tech, probably not a Lefty bastion given it is located in Lubbock.
#215. To: sneakypete (#165)
#216. To: TooConservative (#203)
#217. To: tpaine (#209)
#218. To: redleghunter (#60)
He is alone, trying to blend in with locals and then he finds his spot sets up and waits...alone.
#219. To: tpaine (#209)
Agreed. When I went to jump school, (Ft Campbell 1955) it really wasn't that bad. -- If memory serves, we had less than a 5% drop out rate.
#220. To: TooConservative (#203)
#221. To: CZ82 (#204)
Obsessed over something I have never seen, OK whatever.
#222. To: Palmdale (#221)
#223. To: GarySpFC (#219)
The drop rate was approximately 35 to 40% AT Benning IN 1963.
#224. To: CZ82, misterwhite (#222)
It was from a series of conversations I've had in the past with tpaine.
#225. To: Palmdale (#224)
#226. To: GarySpFC (#213)
Special Ops are called the "Quiet Professionals." and he broke the code. You have mistaken his silence in certain areas as lying.
#227. To: CZ82 (#225)
So has he found Roscoe?
#228. To: Palmdale (#224)
CZ82 --- It was from a series of conversations I've had in the past with tpaine.
#229. To: redleghunter (#214)
There were, however, radiological materials still at Tuwaitha before ground forces arrived.
I don't remember the exact materials, but hundreds of HAZMAT 55gal barrels were found empty, and many looted and found in homes later. The site was sealed and guarded. Medical teams monitored and tested soldiers who came in contact with the site or barrels.
The leukemia occurrence increase for the civilian population near the site increased a few years later.
#230. To: redleghunter (#220)
However the Navy pushed for a land fight. All about who gets the dough.
#231. To: TooConservative (#230)
Congress should take firm action
#232. To: Otter (#231)
#233. To: Palmdale (#227)
#234. To: CZ82 (#233)
There must be dozens of Roscoe's.
#235. To: Pericles (#82)
Fit, yes. Bright?
#236. To: Pericles (#84)
And SEAL is nothing special. Ventura was in the same military unit before they were given the cooler and more catchy SEAL's name.
#237. To: Pericles (#88)
#238. To: sneakypete (#192)
(Edited)
IMHO,the SEALS have no business taking on ground combat roles. They really don't have the training or the mindset for it,and most likely lose a lot of people in combat that a USMC Force Recon team wouldn't lose.
#239. To: TooConservative (#146)
#240. To: CZ82 (#239)
Looks like he's about to hang himself again.
#241. To: TooConservative (#226)
He already broke the SEAL code that there is no such thing as a one-man operation. He did it to grab money and fame.
#242. To: GarySpFC (#241)
BTW, He donated all monies from his book.
#243. To: CZ82 (#233)
There must be dozens of Roscoe's.
#244. To: TooConservative (#242)
His SEAL colleagues, inasmuch as they spoke, disputed his account and said he shouldn't have written it. Not one defended his book.
#245. To: Palmdale (#244)
I say you're lying.
Chris donated profits from his book, “American Sniper,”
#246. To: TooConservative (#245)
His SEAL colleagues, inasmuch as they spoke, disputed his account
#247. To: Palmdale (#246)
You always lie.
#248. To: TooConservative (#247)
After you made a false accusation due to your poor reading habits
#249. To: Palmdale (#248)
But you won't retract your lie about Robert O'Neill, will ya?
Did Robert O'Neill really kill bin Laden?(Opinion) - CNN.com
Ex-Navy Seals' dispute over who shot Osama Bin Laden - BBC News
Bin Laden's Shooter Goes Public, But Fellow SEALs Dispute ...
#250. To: GarySpFC (#207)
This is America, NOT Russia where lies are the standard. Go learn the difference.
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