[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Mail]  [Sign-in]  [Setup]  [Help]  [Register] 

Trump Is Planning to Send Kill Teams to Mexico to Take Out Cartel Leaders

The Great Falling Away in the Church is Here | Tim Dilena

How Ridiculous? Blade-Less Swiss Army Knife Debuts As Weapon Laws Tighten

Jewish students beaten with sticks at University of Amsterdam

Terrorists shut down Park Avenue.

Police begin arresting democrats outside Met Gala.

The minute the total solar eclipse appeared over US

Three Types Of People To Mark And Avoid In The Church Today

Are The 4 Horsemen Of The Apocalypse About To Appear?

France sends combat troops to Ukraine battlefront

Facts you may not have heard about Muslims in England.

George Washington University raises the Hamas flag. American Flag has been removed.

Alabama students chant Take A Shower to the Hamas terrorists on campus.

In Day of the Lord, 24 Church Elders with Crowns Join Jesus in His Throne

In Day of the Lord, 24 Church Elders with Crowns Join Jesus in His Throne

Deadly Saltwater and Deadly Fresh Water to Increase

Deadly Cancers to soon Become Thing of the Past?

Plague of deadly New Diseases Continues

[FULL VIDEO] Police release bodycam footage of Monroe County District Attorney Sandra Doorley traffi

Police clash with pro-Palestine protesters on Ohio State University campus

Joe Rogan Experience #2138 - Tucker Carlson

Police Dispersing Student Protesters at USC - Breaking News Coverage (College Protests)

What Passover Means For The New Testament Believer

Are We Closer Than Ever To The Next Pandemic?

War in Ukraine Turns on Russia

what happened during total solar eclipse

Israel Attacks Iran, Report Says - LIVE Breaking News Coverage

Earth is Scorched with Heat

Antiwar Activists Chant ‘Death to America’ at Event Featuring Chicago Alderman

Vibe Shift

A stream that makes the pleasant Rain sound.

Older Men - Keep One Foot In The Dark Ages

When You Really Want to Meet the Diversity Requirements

CERN to test world's most powerful particle accelerator during April's solar eclipse

Utopian Visionaries Who Won’t Leave People Alone

No - no - no Ain'T going To get away with iT

Pete Buttplug's Butt Plugger Trying to Turn Kids into Faggots

Mark Levin: I'm sick and tired of these attacks

Questioning the Big Bang

James Webb Data Contradicts the Big Bang

Pssst! Don't tell the creationists, but scientists don't have a clue how life began

A fine romance: how humans and chimps just couldn't let go

Early humans had sex with chimps

O’Keefe dons bulletproof vest to extract undercover journalist from NGO camp.

Biblical Contradictions (Alleged)

Catholic Church Praising Lucifer

Raising the Knife

One Of The HARDEST Videos I Had To Make..

Houthi rebels' attack severely damages a Belize-flagged ship in key strait leading to the Red Sea (British Ship)

Chinese Illegal Alien. I'm here for the moneuy


Status: Not Logged In; Sign In

United States News
See other United States News Articles

Title: 'American Sniper': Prominent Libertarian Claims There Is No Difference Between Chris Kyle and Mass Murderer Adam Lanza
Source: http://www.hngn.com/
URL Source: http://www.hngn.com/articles/65352/ ... ce-between-chris-kyle-mass.htm
Published: Jan 31, 2015
Author: ida Ahmed
Post Date: 2015-01-31 15:56:37 by Gatlin
Keywords: None
Views: 80431
Comments: 315

A prominent libertarian activist has made controversial comparisons between the late "American Sniper" protagonist Navy SEAL Chris Kyle and mass murderer Adam Lanza, who killed 28 people in a 2012 shooting spree.

Lanza isn't much different from Kyle, a Navy SEAL sniper who killed 160 people during multiple combat tours in Iraq, Sheldon Richman, vice president of the Future of Freedom Foundation, said on Wednesday. Two years ago, Lanza shot his mother to death, then proceeded to a nearby Sandy Hook Elementary School and killed 20 first-graders and six staffers before committing suicide.

"Excuse me, but I have trouble seeing an essential difference between what Kyle did in Iraq and what Adam Lanza did at Sandy Hook Elementary School. It certainly was not heroism," Richman wrote in an op-ed published on the Future of Freedom Foundation website and reprinted by Reason.com.

"Despite what some people think, hero is not a synonym for competent government-hired killer," he added.

Speaking about the widely debated Clint Eastwood's movie, Richman slammed Kyle's actions, Breitbart reported.

"Let's recall some facts, which perhaps Eastwood thought were too obvious to need mention: Kyle was part of an invasion force: Americans went to Iraq. Iraq did not invade America or attack Americans. Dictator Saddam Hussein never even threatened to attack Americans," he continued. "Contrary to what the George W. Bush administration suggested, Iraq had nothing to do with the attacks on Sept. 11, 2001. Before Americans invaded Iraq, Al Qaeda was not there. Nor was it in Syria, Yemen, and Libya."

"Wars of aggression, let's remember, are illegal under international law. Nazis were executed at Nuremberg for waging wars of aggression."

"The only reason Kyle went to Iraq was that Bush/Cheney & Co. launched a war of aggression against the Iraqi people," he wrote.

The deceased sniper cannot be deemed a hero because the American military personnel's lives that he was protecting  were the aggressors themselves, according to Richman, Newsmax reported.

"What American lives? The lives of American military personnel who invaded another people's country, one that was no threat to them or their fellow Americans back home."

If "an invader kills someone who is trying to resist the invasion, that does not count as heroic self-defense; the invader is the aggressor. If anyone's the hero, it's the latter," he wrote.

The people who Kyle killed on the battlefield only threatened Americans because "American forces waged an unprovoked war against them," he added. "No Iraqi asked to be killed by Kyle, but it sure looks as though Kyle was asking to be killed by an Iraqi. [Instead, another vet did the job.

Post Comment   Private Reply   Ignore Thread  


TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

Comments (1-170) not displayed.
      .
      .
      .

#171. To: tpaine (#163)

BTW,I should confess right here that I am one of those people who see sniping as a necessary evil.

Me too. I always thought the WW II snipers were the most interesting. The Russians had some awesome snipers and plenty of German targets to hit. They made a significant impact.

Of course, the Russians were resisting a genocidal Nazi invasion so you have a certain sympathy for Russkies defending their own country against an invader and so we generally overlook the Soviets' many other horrible shortcomings as a society and country.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   11:45:01 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#172. To: sneakypete (#170)

I thought Ventura was supposed to have completed the basic UDT school but left the service about the time the SEALs were created as a program. But I haven't read about it in years. I always knew he was no SEAL, no matter what he said. OTOH, who is going to sue a pro wrestler type, where anything he says he'll just blame on his phony wrestler persona. You'd never manage to nail him on Stolen Valor charges and most of his SEAL claims were made well before that law passed Congress.

And Ventura was close enough to being a SEAL that he apparently gets invited to some SEALish events, like that graduation where Kyle claimed (falsely) to have given Ventura a black eye.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   11:49:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#173. To: TooConservative (#103) (Edited)

Combat veterans usually don't like the war movies

I LOVED "We Were Soldiers Once,and Young",and "Blackhawk Down".

I also liked "Saving Private Ryan" a lot.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   11:49:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#174. To: sneakypete (#167)

Let's not pretend SEALS are warriors AND scholars.

And let's not pretend most scholars understand the first thing about being a warrior,never mind being one themselves.

Kyle was a high school graduate only. Let us not pretend SEALs are comic book super soldiers.

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-01   11:53:41 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#175. To: TooConservative (#110)

AFAIK, they still maintain it was brought down by a RPG (rocket-propelled grenade). That meant the guy who fired it had to be close ...

Yup. It also means it was a lucky shot for him because they aren't the most accurate weapons in the world,and the rear hatch on a Chinook isn't that big and it is moving.

....and that meant he was in a lot of danger to fire at so many SEALs like that.

Not really. The SEALS inside were sitting on seats running the length of the fuselage,and they couldn't return fire. There is generally a machine gunner firing out the ramp door if bad guys are close,but he can't see and shoot at everything when the position is being swarmed.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   11:55:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#176. To: TooConservative, sneakypete (#172) (Edited)

I thought Ventura was supposed to have completed the basic UDT school but left the service about the time the SEALs were created as a program. But I haven't read about it in years. I always knew he was no SEAL, no matter what he said. OTOH, who is going to sue a pro wrestler type, where anything he says he'll just blame on his phony wrestler persona. You'd never manage to nail him on Stolen Valor charges and most of his SEAL claims were made well before that law passed Congress.

Since Ventura was a alum of SEAL veteran association - you know open to seal members only - it is a safe bet he was considered a SEAL or a precursor to the SEALS and thus one of them.

Notice this was written before the verdict was reached in Ventura's favor and it was secure in the belief that Kyle would beat Ventura. I have to hand it to Ventura for having the internal fortitude to launch a defamation case because those are almost impossible to win for a celebrity unless the defendant is caught in a provable lie.

http://sofrep.com/36086/truth-jesse-venturas-navy-seal-status/

I’ve heard the speculation and gossip about Jesse Ventura’s Navy SEAL status and wanted to set the record straight. Jesse Ventura graduated with Basic Underwater Demolition Class 58 and, like it or not, he earned his status. Some say he’s a UDT (Underwater Demolition Team), and not a “SEAL,” but that’s bullshit.

Others have seen the flaw in this analogy, and mentioned in private SEAL forums, “try telling that to a WWII UDT veteran who swam ashore before the landing craft on D-Day.” The UDT’s and SEALs are essentially one and the same. It’s why the UDT is still part of the training acronym BUD/S (Basic Underwater Demolition/SEAL).

Like it or not, Jesse Ventura is a Navy SEAL. He did the pushups and put up with the cold water, just like the rest of us.

Many are rightfully upset that he took a personal issue between himself and the late Chris Kyle and is now going after his widow and children in a lawsuit that is currently in the trial phase. SOFREP has recently spoke with legal insiders who are trial side and they are putting the odds squarely in the court of the Kyle estate in their opinion, and that’s good news for everyone.

Read more: http://sofrep.com/36086/truth-jesse-venturas-navy-seal- status/#ixzz3QVuOoZSh

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-01   11:57:51 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#177. To: sneakypete (#175)

t also means it was a lucky shot for him because they aren't the most accurate weapons in the world

Hence my later remarks on how there are great shots and there are lucky shots and then there are great lucky shots that almost defy belief.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   11:58:15 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#178. To: Pericles (#176)

Since Ventura was a alum of SEAL veteran association - you know open to seal members only - it is a safe bet he was considered a SEAL or a precursor to the SEALS and thus one of them.

I'd say he was close enough to being a SEAL.

You do notice Ventura has definitely backed off all his SEAL claims since the Stolen Valor law passed. He used to hawk himself that way regularly.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   11:59:31 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#179. To: Pericles (#121)

then in real life would he or his SF pals have a problem shooting Americans in the streets for money?

First off,Kyle wasn't Special Forces. He was a SEAL,and in the Navy.

ONLY soldiers in the US Army can become Special Forces soldiers.

And finally,I don't know of anyone in SF when I was in uniform that would follow orders to snipe at American citizens.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:02:05 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#180. To: sneakypete (#173)

I LOVED "We Were Soldiers Once,and Young",and "Blackhawk Down". I also liked "Saving Private Ryan" a lot.

To pick a few at random, I like Midway a lot because it helped viewers understand some of the complexities of that decisive battle. And I still like Tora Tora Tora and watch it again every few years.

I like the big picture movies, I guess. Especially about Japan as Russia really kicked Germany's ass but Japan was all our war. Of course, I do fast-forward past any parts where they talk about their feelings.

I also like sub movies. Probably Das Boot tops my list.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   12:03:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#181. To: Pericles (#176)

Ventura was a alum of SEAL veteran association

The non-governmental "UDT-SEAL Association"?

"The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts

Palmdale  posted on  2015-02-01   12:04:03 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#182. To: TooConservative (#132)

You also have to question taking a PTSD soldier to a firing range as a matter of personal judgment.

Yeah,I had a "WTF????" moment over that one,myself.

I can only guess it is the "video game mindset" of he younger generation,combined with the fact that snipers kill people at such a distance it doesn't seem real.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:05:16 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#183. To: TooConservative (#178)

Since Ventura was a alum of SEAL veteran association - you know open to seal members only - it is a safe bet he was considered a SEAL or a precursor to the SEALS and thus one of them. I'd say he was close enough to being a SEAL.

You do notice Ventura has definitely backed off all his SEAL claims since the Stolen Valor law passed. He used to hawk himself that way regularly.

That law would not affect Ventura.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolen_Valor_Act_of_2013

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-01   12:05:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#184. To: sneakypete, Pericles (#179)

First off,Kyle wasn't Special Forces. He was a SEAL,and in the Navy.

Hey, take it easy on Pericles! He's typing on a smartphone.

"The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts

Palmdale  posted on  2015-02-01   12:06:28 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#185. To: Palmdale (#181)

Ventura was a alum of SEAL veteran association

The non-governmental "UDT-SEAL Association"?

They are not capable of assessing who is a SEAL or not? I guess you don't like the private sector after all.

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-01   12:06:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#186. To: TooConservative (#142)

Notice how the Kyle fanbois seem to disappear as his lies about killing two guys at the Texas gas station come up and especially his bragging (lies) about running a sniper operation against civilians during Katrina?

Suddenly they aren't quite so interested in Kyle.

Good for them! It speaks highly for them that they are able to use facts as tools to change their opinions.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:07:20 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#187. To: Pericles (#185)

They are not capable of assessing who is a SEAL or not?

UDT, not SEAL. Or are you pretending the UDT-SEAL Association pronounced the wrassler an honorary SEAL or something?

"The biggest mistake that libertarians make is the way they view government and private sectors. Government is the root of all evil, and the private sector is the source of all good. Libertarians have never figured out that people are the same whether in the government or in the private sector." --Paul Craig Roberts

Palmdale  posted on  2015-02-01   12:09:14 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#188. To: Pericles, sneakypete (#176)

Others have seen the flaw in this analogy, and mentioned in private SEAL forums, “try telling that to a WWII UDT veteran who swam ashore before the landing craft on D-Day.” The UDT’s and SEALs are essentially one and the same. It’s why the UDT is still part of the training acronym BUD/S (Basic Underwater Demolition/SEAL).

He's entitled to his opinion but the SEAL program became much more extensive in land warfare during the Vietnam era as Ventura was getting out of the service.

Fast forward to modern times and SEALs are doing all kinds of stuff completely outside any naval context, going well beyond even what the Marines do.

Or, to put it briefly, I'll agree that UDTs are the same as SEALs when you tell me how many campaigns deep in the Mideast deserts or African deserts were fought by UDTs in WW II. Because we know the SEALs operate in jungles, mountains and deserts and are probably ready to take on polar combat as well. The UDTs were really naval guys and supported amphibious landings and sabotaging ships and port facilities and nearby factories and such.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   12:09:25 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#189. To: TooConservative (#171)

Me too. I always thought the WW II snipers were the most interesting.

The trench warfare of WW-1 is where sniping played it's biggest role.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:12:33 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#190. To: sneakypete, TooConservative (#182)

You also have to question taking a PTSD soldier to a firing range as a matter of personal judgment. Yeah,I had a "WTF????" moment over that one,myself.

I can only guess it is the "video game mindset" of he younger generation,combined with the fact that snipers kill people at such a distance it doesn't seem real.

Want to get conspiracy minded? Kyle was part of something called "Craft International". http://www.thecraft.com/Training.html

If you want a private army of killers then people with PTSD maybe good for carrying out certain assignments? Or it could be a simple case of them trying to gain 'good publicity' over training returning vets to be mercenaries.

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-01   12:14:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#191. To: TooConservative, sneakypete (#188) (Edited)

I know of no SEAL vet association that rejects UDT era vets. At the time the UDTS were as good as we had for what we now imagine is a SEAL and formed the foundation for modern SEALS - An impressive accomplishment by Ventura in his pre Wrestling years regardless.

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-01   12:16:34 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#192. To: TooConservative (#172)

I thought Ventura was supposed to have completed the basic UDT school but left the service about the time the SEALs were created as a program.

There were SEAL teams as early as 1964. I know this for a fact because I went through Jump School at Ft.Benning with several of them. AFAIK,all the SEALS back then came from the UDT teams,so naturally the UDT training would be "SEAL Basic Training".

The SEALS came from the Navy seeing they were going to lose some of the military budget money and clout unless they developed a ground warfare group NOT called "The US Marine Corps",so I guess they figured he easiest way to go with this would be to add a ground combat mission to the traditional UDT "water and beach" missions.

Frankly,I have never understood why the SEAL teams were ever created. They don't do a single damn thing when it comes to ground combat missions that the USMC hasn't been doing for a couple of hundred years now. I can only guess that the Navy brass has always traditionally hated the USMC,and wanted to grab some of the glory for the anchor clankers.

IMHO,the SEALS have no business taking on ground combat roles. They really don't have the training or the mindset for it,and most likely lose a lot of people in combat that a USMC Force Recon team wouldn't lose.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:21:54 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#193. To: Pericles (#174)

Kyle was a high school graduate only.

And.....?

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:22:47 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#194. To: Pericles (#176)

Some say he’s a UDT (Underwater Demolition Team), and not a “SEAL,” but that’s bullshit.

Is that so,scholar?

Spent a lot of time in Special Operations,did ya?

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:24:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#195. To: sneakypete, TooConservative (#192)

IMHO,the SEALS have no business taking on ground combat roles. They really don't have the training or the mindset for it,and most likely lose a lot of people in combat that a USMC Force Recon team wouldn't lose.

I pondered that upon learning the recent scrubbed mission of a SEALs team against al-Qaeda in Yemen that was thwarted by guard dogs. Would a land based team have forgotten about the use of dogs to sniff out intruders?

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-01   12:26:40 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#196. To: TooConservative (#180)

I also like sub movies.

Me,too. Also books about submarine warfare. I have no idea why.

And being slightly claustrophobic,you couldn't get me in one of those SOB's at gunpoint.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:27:21 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#197. To: sneakypete (#194)

Is that so,scholar?Some say he’s a UDT (Underwater Demolition Team), and not a “SEAL,” but that’s bullshit.

Is that so,scholar?

Spent a lot of time in Special Operations,did ya?

See the link those words were posted by someone involved in such affairs.

Pericles  posted on  2015-02-01   12:27:37 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#198. To: Pericles (#191) (Edited)

An impressive accomplishment by Ventura in his pre Wrestling years regardless.

True enough. But still not a SEAL. The real SEAL program was just developing from the UDTs when Ventura got out. UDT and SEAL programs both operated through the Seventies.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   12:27:50 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#199. To: sneakypete (#196)

And being slightly claustrophobic,you couldn't get me in one of those SOB's at gunpoint.

Me either.     : )

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   12:28:23 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#200. To: Pericles (#190)

If you want a private army of killers then people with PTSD maybe good for carrying out certain assignments?

Ok,it's plain to see you have never been around anyone that has a genuine case of PTSD.

Here is a hint. They ain't the most organized people in the world.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:31:09 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#201. To: Pericles (#195)

I pondered that upon learning the recent scrubbed mission of a SEALs team against al-Qaeda in Yemen that was thwarted by guard dogs. Would a land based team have forgotten about the use of dogs to sniff out intruders?

Well, dogs really are not that common in Muslim countries because Muslims just hate dogs and consider dog owners to be bad Muslims. So even their military and security aren't going to like using dogs the way the rest of us do. So SEALs probably haven't encountered guard dogs that often in recent missions in the Mideast.

Anyway, that does occur to me as a likely explanation. Most often, the SEALs rely on stealth in their mission plans. If dogs were going to raise the alarm on them, their plan was foiled easily and they regrouped rather than stage an abortive or fruitless raid.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   12:31:49 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#202. To: Pericles (#195)

I pondered that upon learning the recent scrubbed mission of a SEALs team against al-Qaeda in Yemen that was thwarted by guard dogs. Would a land based team have forgotten about the use of dogs to sniff out intruders?

No.

Face it,the SEALS are geared towards high-profile raids where they are only on the ground for a day or two at the most. Usually for only a couple of hours.

IMHO,the Seal Lt in the most recent Hollywood movie about SEALS is directly responsible for the death of his team mates due to having that "Hollywood mindset". He should have either killed the 2 kids herding the goats,or just tied them to a tree and cancelled the mission and pulled his men out. He needed that "ground combat mindset" instead of the "Hollywood Raid mindset",and he didn't have it. That's what leadership is all about,and that's why they pay leaders the big bucks. You have to make the hard decisions and live with them.

I know this isn't going to make me popular,but it had to be said.

Why is democracy held in such high esteem when it’s the enemy of the minority and makes all rights relative to the dictates of the majority? (Ron Paul,2012)

sneakypete  posted on  2015-02-01   12:37:59 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#203. To: sneakypete (#192)

Frankly,I have never understood why the SEAL teams were ever created. They don't do a single damn thing when it comes to ground combat missions that the USMC hasn't been doing for a couple of hundred years now. I can only guess that the Navy brass has always traditionally hated the USMC,and wanted to grab some of the glory for the anchor clankers.

I agree. I think the Army or Marines should encompass all these activities that the SEALs are in now.

I don't like it when the services try to compete in combat specialties. It ends badly and wastes a lot of money.

Today you see the SEALs plucking off the top recruits across the services. They should all be Army or Marines. Personally, I'd just expand the Army Rangers and put all the SEALs under them. They could have a special program for UDT-qualified operators. And the Navy could keep their own UDT specialists.

SEALs should be part of the Army special forces. Leave the Marines as a separate branch of the Navy, just out of tradition.

Tooconservative  posted on  2015-02-01   12:41:39 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#204. To: Palmdale (#156)

Obsessed over something I have never seen, OK whatever.

So how long do you think I've been posting on political blogs anyway?

“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”

CZ82  posted on  2015-02-01   13:25:46 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#205. To: CZ82 (#204)

So how long do you think I've been posting on political blogs anyway?

Two months and counting.

Fred Mertz  posted on  2015-02-01   14:41:52 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#206. To: Pericles, GarySpFc (#82)

Fit, yes. Bright?

Yes bright. Someone bright or intelligent may not be well educated. Someone well educated can be unremarkable.

When I went to Airborne school I had 5 SEALS in my stick (section). I learned the physical, mental and psychological toils of Buds training and scuba/dive school. A bag of rocks would die in those environments.

"Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools " (Romans 1:21-22)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-02-01   14:53:07 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#207. To: Pericles (#107)

In WW1 and WW2 artillery was used againsts snipers, etc. In fact that is still Russian doctrine. If a building has a sniper in it - blow up the building.

I have been to the Russian Battle for Stalingrad Museum in Volograd just to see Vasily Zaytsev's rifle, which he supposedly used to kill 225 Germans. Kruschev created the lie, because their is no record of the German officer he was going against existing in the German Army.

This is America, NOT Russia where lies are the standard. Go learn the difference.

“Let no one mourn that he has fallen again and again; for forgiveness has risen, from the grave.” John Chrysostom www.evidenceforJesusChrist.org

GarySpFC  posted on  2015-02-01   15:00:19 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#208. To: TooConservative, GarySpFc (#110)

AFAIK, they still maintain it was brought down by a RPG (rocket-propelled grenade). That meant the guy who fired it had to be close and that meant he was in a lot of danger to fire at so many SEALs like that.

So the RPG guy was essentially a sniper with an RPG. Was he brave? Was he a patriot of Afghanistan and a freedom fighter? Or just a terrorist?

In both cases the one shooting was defending their units. Very much so as an artillery unit providing fire support.

In the military we don't put such labels of heroism by specific MOS. It's a team effort. I've seen combat support soldiers act as brave as a commando.

In the case of Kyle he had two Silver stars and four or five BSMs for valor. Those are not handed out like candy and require witnesses and investigation. The Navy I admit is a bit more stingy on the above as I remember from serving attached to 2nd MARDIV during the Gulf War.

So at least for the cited incidents of his valor awards, his peers and leadership sure did think he deserved the recognition.

"Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools " (Romans 1:21-22)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-02-01   15:08:45 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#209. To: redleghunter (#206)

When I went to Airborne school I had 5 SEALS in my stick (section). I learned the physical, mental and psychological toils of Buds training and scuba/dive school. A bag of rocks would die in those environments.

Agreed. When I went to jump school, (Ft Campbell 1955) it really wasn't that bad. -- If memory serves, we had less than a 5% drop out rate.

tpaine  posted on  2015-02-01   15:09:18 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#210. To: Fred Mertz (#205)

Hit your head on a tomahawk again?

“Political correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical minority, and rapidly promoted by mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.”

CZ82  posted on  2015-02-01   15:12:04 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  


#211. To: TooConservative, Pericles, GarySpFc (#117)

Certainly. I wouldn't be surprised if that still happens, especially in the Iraq occupation.

But a military sniper is a military asset and few object to using snipers or choppers or artillery or any other means to wipe out an enemy sniper.

Yes artillery is now considered precision fires. Most of our munitions are GPS or laser guided. The munitions can also be adjusted for yield.

In Iraq in one city we had a sniper problem. We used a low yield 155mm round to kill the sniper on top of a building without damaging the apartments below the roof.

Jihadis use civilian population centers to wage their war so we have to find the weapon with the least collateral effect. And in some cases that would be a sniper.

"Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools " (Romans 1:21-22)

redleghunter  posted on  2015-02-01   15:16:57 ET  Reply   Trace   Private Reply  



      .
      .
      .

Comments (212 - 315) not displayed.

TopPage UpFull ThreadPage DownBottom/Latest

[Home]  [Headlines]  [Latest Articles]  [Latest Comments]  [Post]  [Mail]  [Sign-in]  [Setup]  [Help]  [Register] 

Please report web page problems, questions and comments to webmaster@libertysflame.com